Stick With The Winners

[padrediver]

Welcome to www.ScubaBoard.com: the home of some of the BEST BS-O-Meters in the world. Maunufactures have learned quickly to ID themselves and to do it quickly or face the wrath of our users.

And, uh, how have they learned this? Most posting here don't show their faces, so how do you know that they're "manufacturers"....or distributors, company reps etc, etc, etc?
Most who do show their faces do so with a mask on! Kinda hard to ID them!
On the internet, no one knows you're a dog....or a rep/distributor/Aquacon CEO.
(or the night security guard at the Aquacon plant being paid a little "bonus"
to post "my aquacon seasnake 2000 is the best durn reg I've ever owned")
(it's also the ONLY reg he ever owned...cause they gave him one free!)
(you tryin' to fool an 'ol fool?)

Old companies get old for a reason.....people keep buying their product, year in and year out, due to word of mouth. If all these new reg brands were so good, how
come Aqualung/Dacor/etc are still in business?

The only "consumer reports" type group reporting on regulators was recently
found to be showing favoritism to companies that spent the most advertising
in their publication.

Forty years around this stuff has taught me the same lesson I learned
growing up in a military intelligence family:

"Believe nothing you hear and half of what you see".

Adios.

 

[Trinigordo]

MY BS-o-meter just sounded it's alarm. Ferrari has absolutely nothing to do with safety. Volvo has absolutely everything to do with safety. Two completely different design philosophies. Many think I drive Volvo for prestige. I drive Volvo because the car actually HAS saved my life! (independent safety cage inside three
layers of metal.(five layers total). The name of the game is survival.

Well then my suggestion to you if you are going to play your little game of survival you should stop diving instead of worrying about different regulator brands. Because I mean diving is dangerous and you are just here to survive right?

A volvo might save your life, but would it get you laid? or could you drive your volvo at a speed of over 150 mph if you were so inclined? There are more considerations than just safety and if you think there aren't I suggest you quit the sport that just makes you assume certain risks.

 

[Trinigordo]

Everyone seems to agree that when tested Atomics perform the best, so best performance would be a sufficient enough reason to change regs.

 

[padrediver]

Everyone seems to agree that when tested Atomics perform the best, so best performance would be a sufficient enough reason to change regs.

"Everyone" agrees? Coulda fooled me!

For some strange reason my intuition tells me you
spent your money on one or more Atomics.

If Atomics are best, how come I don't see the working pro divers using them much?
(these guys make $100,000+ a year so money isn't the reason.)

How come I see the guys whose living depends on their gear using
Aqualung/Apeks/Scubapro/Mares? (very old tried and true companies)
IE: oil rig divers here in Texas. IE: NAUI instructors IE:U.S./British Navies
I see mostly Aqualung/Scubapro/Mares on the rental racks.
LDS are interested in reliability first....they don't want to be sued out of their booties
cause a rental reg popped a 1st mainspring and a neo diver drowned!

Scuba gear is what is known as a "fragmented" market.
Ever hear of "brand loyalty". If someone's first reg was an Aquacon Seasnake 2000
and it worked for them, they'll plug it to their friends for the rest of their lives.
It makes them less insecure about their purchase if they can convince others to buy one.

 

[padrediver]

Well then my suggestion to you if you are going to play your little game of survival you should stop diving instead of worrying about different regulator brands. Because I mean diving is dangerous and you are just here to survive right?

A volvo might save your life, but would it get you laid? or could you drive your volvo at a speed of over 150 mph if you were so inclined? There are more considerations than just safety and if you think there aren't I suggest you quit the sport that just makes you assume certain risks.

Been to the pub, Trinigordo?

My WIFE takes care of the "laying".....my car has no say in the matter.
(She does suspiciously like my Bertram, however. Hmmm?)

My Volvo will go 140mph/280kph...speedometer says so.(only had it up to 120, however.)

You are more likely to be killed DRIVING to your dive site than diving.
(this is in both NAUI and PADI courses!)


More surfers/beach bathers/car drivers are killed in the water than certified scuba divers every year.

Been diving since 1965. Have survived many, many dives in many places.

 

[Trinigordo]

"Everyone" agrees? Coulda fooled me!

For some strange reason my intuition tells me you
spent your money on one or more Atomics.

Nope, I have an Aeris pro reg and an oceanic octo, I own zero Atomic products. Now you know what they say about assuming don't they? Well that is exactly why.

Check all the regulator reviews, and you will see that the Atomics are always very highly rated by all the reviewers.

 

[Trinigordo]

Been to the pub, Trinigordo?

My WIFE takes care of the "laying".....my car has no say in the matter.
(She does suspiciously like my Bertram, however. Hmmm?)

My Volvo will go 140mph/280kph...speedometer says so.(only had it up to 120, however.)

You are more likely to be killed DRIVING to your dive site than diving.
(this is in both NAUI and PADI courses!)


More surfers/beach bathers/car drivers are killed in the water than certified scuba divers every year.

Been diving since 1965. Have survived many, many dives in many places.

Why are you arguing a point just for the sake of arguing? Clearly you are not trying to compare the topspeed and looks of your volvo with that of a Ferrari.

And obviously you are not downplaying the risks we are all exposing ourselves to while we dive? I am not saying we all are exposed to huge risks where it is likely we die, but everytime any of us dive we risk drowning, DCS, embolisms, animal attacks, etc. no matter how low the incidence you are clearly increasing your risk levels by diving

From your saying that the only thing that matters is safety then why expose yourself to more risk, no matter how much risk it is, if survival is the name of the game the point of the game would be eliminating risks and not sticking with the oldest company because they must be doing something right to be in business this long.

Just unsound logic, there are more considerations into a business' success than its product, there are also things like marketing, and pricing to be considered. Point of the story is your assumption is not logical. But do whatever suits you, I know I will do what suits me, and that is why there is variety in the marketplace. Different strokes for different folks and all that.

BTW, a couple of the LDS in Tobago that I frequent are no longer using Mares products due to their receiving whole batches of faulty regulators and poorly made BCDs. As it is basically understood where I come from Mares product originating from their Chinese factory is suspect, but I never have used a mares reg or BCD so I merely speculate using hearsay from what I consider more than one reliable source.

 

[padrediver]

I never said that the only thing was safety.
I have been a risk taker all my life.
I just like to maximize the odds in my favor.
I have had several smart-a friends killed
way before their time in high speed sports cars.

I don't know any of the reviewers personally.
I just know pro working divers and what I see them actually using.

Last week I had a recently arrived young South African Rig Diver
who was working in sales at a LDS whilst awaiting his "VISA"
expound on the virtues of Atomic. I asked him what he owned.
He replied: Apeks and Mares, of course!

Why do you own Aeris/Oceanic if you like Atomic so much?

 

[Trinigordo]

I never said that the only thing was safety.
I have been a risk taker all my life.
I just like to maximize the odds in my favor.
I have had several smart-a friends killed
way before their time in high speed sports cars.

I don't know any of the reviewers personally.
I just know pro working divers and what I see them actually using.

And why do they use these regs? Is it because they used to be the best reg brands and they are doing the whole brand loyalty thing you described earlier? My grandfather still thinks a typewriter is better than a computer, does it make him right or a creature of habit? All the above are written in question form as they are still purely speculation on my part, I am just trying to convey a totally different school of thought here. Some people like old proven goods, but some people like the new technology and the improvements through the ages even if they aren't as well documented for safety as the old items.

I just find it very hard to believe that a 40 year old reg is technologically able to compete with the top class regs of today and I have kind of noticed a trend with these older companies sticking to what works, while the newer companies are trying their hardest to move forward and probably already have a superior product and if not they will in time.

I wouldn't use equipment because the commercial oil rig divers are using them. Recreational diving and commercial diving are apples and oranges.

 

[Trinigordo]

Why do you own Aeris/Oceanic if you like Atomic so much?

Because I don't need the best performing rig on Earth, but instead I needed a rig that was good and something I could afford. The prices on the Atomic regulators are prohibitive on a student's budget. Furthermore I have never dove an Atomic reg, just saying what the reviewers say. Most magazines give them high scores for all their tested traits.