Split/Paddle, Anything in the middle or other?

[Coalcracker]

I have owned Jets, Rockets, Force fins, Swimmaster, etc. Some of the other fins to consider in this thread would be the first Mares Power Plana fins, and the Power Plana Graphite, some of the first fins using composite materials. I still have both of the Power Plana versions. They are a bit scuffed up but still work well. The Apollo Prestige fin was also a great paddle fin version. Now, most of the time, I use the bio-fins.

 

[danvolker]

Well, I agree with Meesier on one point, the Volker post is junk science, I don't even know where to begin on that one. Darn, I keep getting the giggles, ahem, cough. Concerning the original question, try the Aeris Mako or the Apollo Biofin. If you want something in the middle, try the Force Fin, it is in the middle of left field.

If it is junk science, then why would it be so effortless for me to leave any of you guys behind me, with the type of fins you are suggesting. I think you have been reading too much dive industry propaganda, and are forgetting that real world results will mean much more. My offer is open to any of you guys with splits or force fins. Either your fins are more eficient, or they are not. Lets prove this

And the "reason" for the freediving fin is not specifically to go faster than everyone else, it is to travel at a given scuba pace, with much less effort than anyone using the fins you suggest. This means less air for the freedive fin diver to go through, and more comfort throughout the dive. It also means a huge margin for safety if you ever "have to" beat a huge current, or some other non-planned event requires high speed potential.

Dan

 

[meesier42]

If it is junk science, then why would it be so effortless for me to leave any of you guys behind me

the real question is why it will be so easy for me to leave you behind

, with the type of fins you are suggesting. I think you have been reading too much dive industry propaganda, and are forgetting that real world results will mean much more.

you mean like the previous test that I have done over the last 10 years, including one for Spearing Magazine just 3 weeks ago that showed that FF can match or beat freedive fins, oh ya, you have read that one yet, cause it hasn't been published.

My offer is open to any of you guys with splits or force fins. Either your fins are more efficient, or they are not. Lets prove this

I just wish that people would believe the evidence they are given. but alas, I get to go prove it yet again.

 

[danvolker]

the real question is why it will be so easy for me to leave you behind

Like I said before, I will cover your dive expenses, just to prove this point. I have used Force fins, and dove with many people with force fins--there is no way anyone on this board will keep up with a good freediver using freedive fins, and I will bet plenty, that no one on this board will be able to keep up with me, using the inferior force or split fins. I will put my money where "your mouth" is I will pay for the tanks you use, your meals throughout a dive day, and I will cover the cost of the boat for the day...I made a Force fin challenge back in the late 90's that stood for many years, with no one ever being able to come close to keeping up, to me and my buddies-- just cruising easy.
This is an issue I would like to prove, to discount all the drivel the split fin companies have been dishing out, and the nonsense from the dive industry in general.


If this is not "sweetening the pot" enough to get some "hotshots" with splits or force fins to step up, then tell me what you need to take up the challenge, and to prove your point.

you mean like the previous test that I have done over the last 10 years, including one for Spearing Magazine just 3 weeks ago that showed that FF can match or beat freedive fins, oh ya, you have read that one yet, cause it hasn't been published.

As most magazines are advertorial in nature, tests are a joke. Look at Rodales. Tests in it could make you laugh so hard you could choke.

If you think you have something, show up in Palm Beach.

I just wish that people would believe the evidence they are given. but alas, I get to go prove it yet again.

The evidence in bogus tests won't fly. Prove it in real life, and we can have it video of the event ( I can have a buddy on a Gavin shoot from behind).

Regards,
Dan Volker

 

[Zieg]

My Dad, er, Fins can kick your fins butt.

Can not.

Can too.

CAN not.

CAN too.

CAN NOT.

CAN TOO.

GNYAT AH

AHHH HUHHH

PROVE IT! I DARE YA!

I DARE YOU.

WELL I DOG DARE YA!

WELL I DOUBLE DOG DARE YOU!

And the next thing you know somebody is left outside with their thing frozen to the flagpole.

 

[Shaka Doug]

No one has mentioned MorFins yet. These have got to be the best all around fin going these days. I compared mine to SCUBABPRO Splits and Mares Quattros the other day on a dive. The Quattros were very hard to kick with. I felt a lot of strain on the top of my foot. They did move me well but the demand on my muscles wasn't worth it. It felt as though I was pulling the fin along behind me at times too. I could feel both propulsion and drag throughout the kick cycle. The propulsion was nice but the drag is completely undesirable.

The SCUBABPRO splits were fairly easy to kick but sloppy when it came to manuevering around and changing direction. They felt draggy too. They remind me of those goldfish you see with the bugged out eyes and big, fancy sloppy tails. Not real good for moving around underwater.

If you want to know why MorFins are so great, touch a pair. Slide your hand across the fin and feel for resistance....there is none! Not the case with virtually every other fin out there. Water being 800 times denser than air makes a big difference to us when we wear slick fins or bumpy fins. Fish have no bumps on their fins. They don't have stiffening rails on the edges either. These bumps and rails create a lot of resistance and drag. The last thing you want when you are trying to be efficient is 'drag'.

After my test the other day it leaves me wondering why on earth anyone would want to go diving with fins that felt heavy and sluggish. Especially now that MorFins are available!

 

[danvolker]

So once again, there are no Force Fin or Split fin wearing divers that believe in real contests to prove the efficiency or speed of the fins---only people with vested interests in marketing these fins, who want everyone to believe ridicuous tests in magazines with zero equipment review credibility.

Tell me there is someone out there that believes in the splits or Force fins enough to take up the challenge.

Dan

 

[mkutyna]

I'll take up the challenge if you take me out to the reef and let me swim along at a nice slow pace so I can enjoy the scenery.

 

[meesier42]

So once again, there are no Force Fin or Split fin wearing divers that believe in real contests to prove the efficiency or speed of the fins---only people with vested interests in marketing these fins, who want everyone to believe ridicuous tests in magazines with zero equipment review credibility.

Tell me there is someone out there that believes in the splits or Force fins enough to take up the challenge.

Dan

I already promised to take you up on it, but... I have a real job and I have do that first, can't drop everything and show up on your doorstep. and, the testing that I just did, not 3 weeks ago, was just this test, FF, Splits and Freedive fins. and yes the freedive fins did very well, but the FF's proved to match or beat them. The splits fell way behind, so far, we stopped testing them after a couple of runs.

 

[danvolker]

I already promised to take you up on it, but... I have a real job and I have do that first, can't drop everything and show up on your doorstep. and, the testing that I just did, not 3 weeks ago, was just this test, FF, Splits and Freedive fins. and yes the freedive fins did very well, but the FF's proved to match or beat them. The splits fell way behind, so far, we stopped testing them after a couple of runs.

Yes you did
But with all the propaganda on scubaboard over splits and Force fins, you would think there would be more than one guy who believed in their fins enough to take up the challenge....I even offered to sweeten the pot further, if it was necessary for someone with good swimming ability, and the force or split fins, to afford the trip here.

In all fairness to your tests, I have been on so many charter boats, where force fin wearers and split wearers have been completely unable to deal with the occaisional side currents we have off of Palm Beach, that I think the real life tests I have witnessed will tell me far more than a magazine test. I have had to drag split fin wearers from the offshore side of the reef, across the crown all the way to the inshore ledge, before they were able to maintain their own position ( once in the protection of the ledge). I have seen so many force fin wearers just barely able to hold a position against the current, if a buddy or other diver wants to stop for a photo op, or to grab a lobster.....and you see groups folowing a divemaster all the time, and the ones who just can't move quickly enough are invariably splits or force fins. If Bob Evans ever does come out with a real "freedive version" of a force fin, maybe that will be a kick ass fin..and then we can have an entirely different discussion

And hearing about a seal team doing a 20 mile swim with force fins is not in any way meaningful to a recreational or technical diver. Go find a SEAL, put some classic Force fins on him, and I will bet $1000 he will be far behind me after a one hour swim at 60 feet deep. This is NOT about "me". This is about fins.
We are constantly barraged with "claims" from fin manufacturers about how efficient their fins are--how fast their fins are....and then as soon as I through the BS flag, someone has to start telling me that diving is not a drag race.....of course it is not. But efficiency is important, and being able to deal with sudden changes in currents ( or wind effecting a boat) is important too.

Dan