Sotis vs. IANTD

[cerich]

That's just old school group think. The new paradigm is TruDive. Just tell it what you've got and it tells you what to do!!!!! No thinking necessary, seriously, just don't think about it.....

no worries, I won't even think about Trudive..

 

[The Chairman]

I was trained by Sotis and have lived to tell. I wrote a pretty favorable review here on SB as well. There was an incident I was asked to not cover, so I didn't. It was a caustic cocktail. I was mostly OK with my training until I did a crossover to my SF2. I noted in my review that Tom McCarthy was far more thorough. I knew there were holes in my training, and I took it upon myself to fill them.

Sure, everyone is different. Everyone is the same. Trying to go back and wipe out everyone's training record is a silly knee jerk reaction to what's happening here. I'm definitely not going to get on the anti-Sotis band wagon as I see no benefit to me or to the sport. In any event, I alone am responsible for me. No one is forcing me to put on a rebreather or even OC. It's my responsibility to understand what I'm diving or to seek additional training. No one forced Stewart to go back down on his ill fated dive. That doesn't mean I don't see a problem with Sotis' fast and loose handling of standards. That's between IANTD and him and I'm happy to let them sort that out between him.

As it sits: it appears that karma just ran over his dogma. He started Add Helium because someone tried to create a monopoly on scrubber. He turned around and tried to create a monopoly on training with a few manufacturers. He became the very thing he did not like.

 

[cathal]

Chris...

Somewhere in all the narrative...which is growing by the day...I may have missed it...but it seems to me that no-one has brought into question the potential low quality of rebreather training that everyone who has gone through the Add Helium turn-stiles may have received...

To ask the question after the fatalities occur is waiting too long...

If I was an Add Helium ''preferred training agency'' official...the question would certainly be rolling around in my mind...

Sub-standard quality of training is nothing new...in scuba...as well as all industries...sub-standard rebreather training ranks among the worst of the worst...

All to often we hear of sub-standard dive instruction...and not often enough do we hear of certified dive students who along with their instructors...should have their certifications revoked...

For any dive certification...rebreather or otherwise...the plastic card is only the key to open the door...practical application based on a firm foundation makes you qualified...if that foundation is lacking from the start...your practical application...based on a poor foundation...will never properly qualify you...

We all like to think we were trained by the best...as the international 2019 scuba related fatalities continue to soar...one has to wonder...''just how qualified are we''...

W.W...

Very well put. It begs the question how many rebreather certs were issued overall by this instructor, and are these divers aware of their precarious knowledge base? As he was a factory instructor for rEvo what is rEvo doing about this??

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Trying to go back and wipe out everyone's training record

I don't believe that is the intent, but give that Dunning-Kruger can be especially brutal in technical diving, the suggestion for remedial training to address possible shortcomings in the training received by Sotis is not unjustified if he has a bodycount that is above industry norms for instructors.

While I'm not yet a rebreather diver, I am aware of several shortcomings in my own technical training, so I have backed off on tech dives until I can address those through practice and workshop/non-certification training.

 

[RyanT]

Trying to go back and wipe out everyone's training record is a silly knee jerk reaction to what's happening here.

Perspective is always an interesting thing. I didn't read anything on this thread suggesting that someone's training record be wiped out. Instead, what I got is that there may be folks out there with inadequate training.

I agree with the sentiment that at the level of CCR diving, everyone should take responsibility for their own safety and training. But...when stepping up to CCR, it seems like it would be easy to get into a "you don't know what you don't know" situation. I'm not a CCR diver, so please feel free to correct me here, but I can easily imagine that if you engage in training with an instructor who leaves holes in your knowledge, you might not know what those holes are.

 

[Bob DBF]

I'm not a CCR diver, so please feel free to correct me here, but I can easily imagine that if you engage in training with an instructor who leaves holes in your knowledge, you might not know what those holes are.

This effect is seen in any training, not just isolated to CCR, or SCUBA in general. While working as a technician, I was trained to service equipment and saw a wide range of quality in the training with holes in knowledge from poor materials, insufficient time, poor training skills, as well as an instructor not understanding the principles he was teaching. As an experienced tech I had an idea of what I needed to learn, and could ask pointed questions that could fill in holes for me, and point them out to new techs, as the classes were for the gear, not based on the experience level.

With any class of novices, they are at the mercy of the instructor, especially if the training materials are not complete or understandable.

As far as "you don't know what you don't know", that is just a condition of life. The best anyone can do is try to minimize the number of things you don't know that are likely to kill you.



Bob

 

[abnfrog]

the whole situation makes me very sad about our industry I loved for over 40 years , makes me wonder about the future here .....it sure was better teaching 25 years ago , wondering why .................