SM Stages - Top Mount vs Bottom Mount

[Manatee Diver]

if you’re full cave consider a stage course.

That and normoxic is what I am preparing for. I have two of my AL80s having vis due shortly, so I was planning to set them up as stages since I rarely dive recreationally. If I need to switch valves the time to do it is right after the vis.

I'll probably buy the deco bottle new, as that I know I want oxygen cleaned.

 

[J-Vo]

multiple stages on one side does not cause you to feel imbalanced. There’s no reason to put one on the right. It is just a way to entrap your long hose, even in sm. I’ve carried 3+ bottles on the left and didn’t feel skewed to the left.

if you’re full cave consider a stage course.

I'm amazed at this. You do know @Manatee Diver is in sidemount?

At our normal "training" hole we regularly drop our travel and 50% before picking up our staged O2 for trimix dives. I have to cross clip that single 80 of O2 to keep balanced.

 

[JBFG]

multiple stages on one side does not cause you to feel imbalanced. There’s no reason to put one on the right. It is just a way to entrap your long hose, even in sm. I’ve carried 3+ bottles on the left and didn’t feel skewed to the left.

if you’re full cave consider a stage course.

How does it trap the long hose? If you dive Reg up, with your bottle in the correct position and your long hose on a swivel turret, it does not get stuck or trap. Adding a stage under your right bottle does not affect the deployment of the long hose at all in this configuration.

Why would you put 3 bottles on your left in SM when you have a perfectly good right side?

I've never seen SM divers with bottles on the left only, but than again I don't dive in Florida so I must be doing it wrong.

 

[rddvet]

I'm amazed at this. You do know @Manatee Diver is in sidemount?

At our normal "training" hole we regularly drop our travel and 50% before picking up our staged O2 for trimix dives. I have to cross clip that single 80 of O2 to keep balanced.

I’m talking about side mount. I have no balance issues. Neither does my 105lb wife or any of the other sm divers we dive with. We all keep all tanks on the left.

How does it trap the long hose? If you dive Reg up, with your bottle in the correct position and your long hose on a swivel turret, it does not get stuck or trap. Adding a stage under your right bottle does not affect the deployment of the long hose at all in this configuration.

Why would you put 3 bottles on your left in SM when you have a perfectly good right side?

I've never seen SM divers with bottles on the left only, but than again I don't dive in Florida so I must be doing it wrong.

I personally don’t agree with bottles on the right. Entrap may be a strong word. But it can add complexity. In class we had a sm diver with a stage on his right, he could donate the long hose fine, but as he pulled it fully out the hose got stuck on the valve of the right stage amd took an extra step to fully deploy. I’m sure how you orient your valves and stow your hoses is a major factor of it being an issue or not. I have a couple instructor friends (well respected tech instructors, not rando ow guys) who have seen similar issues in classes. Most of the sm instructors I respect highly do not recommend right sided stages.(these are all cave instructors not ow tech). In my mind, I don’t like right sided stages. You don’t see people in bm doing it and in my opinion it’s unnecessary in sm. I’m a believer that you should keep things the same when you can. So I dive stages in sm how I would in bm. It’s just my opinion based on almost 10 years of sm experience and from similar opinions in my peer group. Others may be different, and that’s fine too.

 

[JBFG]

Although I don’t agree that right side is bad in SM, I get the parallels drawn here from BM and the muscle memory approach.

thanx

 

[rddvet]

Although I don’t agree that right side is bad in SM, I get the parallels drawn here from BM and the muscle memory approach.

thanx

Yep, just different views. I dive with people in sm, rebreathers, and bm. They all carry stages on the left in all configurations and so do I to make life easy. Also if I cave dive with someone I haven't dove with alot, keeping things consistent with the majority of cave divers (regardless of sm or bm) makes sense. One other issue for me is I don't believe in lean on one side and hot mix on the other. To me it breeds complacency, and is just one more reason not to do it. It's not like I wouldn't dive with someone with stages on the right, I just don't subscribe to it as a necessity or my ideal choice. I also lean dir in mentality which affects my opinion.

 

[Manatee Diver]

Ended up having a conversation with my instructor as we both ended up at CCDS at the same time.

Bottom mount, and left side is preferred. He isn't against having stages on your right side, but he prefers to breath from the left, as that way your regs and bottles are all configured the same and end up being interchangeable.

I already had a set of mirrored valves on my shelf, so I am going to bring two normal valved tanks, plus a single mirrored valve so we can experiment. At worst case that mirrored valve will just be a sidemount AL80 tank.

 

[helodriver87]

Super new to sidemount, but I didn't notice any balance issues carrying two bottles on the left. No more than in doubles at least. I suppose there's nothing wrong with bottom mounting one on the right temporarily, but I wouldn't do any rich right stuff or mirrored valves. It would just be a place to stash the extra bottle until I was ready to drop the left bottle, then transfer it over for the gas switch. Maybe a good place to stow your second deco gas as well (bottom stage and O2 left, 50 right, for example. You'd be standard bottom mount on the left after dropping your bottles at the start). You trap the long hose doing that, but if you're in SM and still carrying two stages, not only is OOG super unlikely, you're not gonna be donating it as an initial action anyways.

 

[tbone1004]

a lot of the balance issues reported are going to be BC related. Remember that with doubles you can almost always pack some extra air into one side or the other to counteract some imbalances. On certain sidemount rigs you can still do that, i.e. Nomad XT. On most of them, you don't have the ability to create that imbalance and that makes the rigs more sensitive, i.e. xDeep, Katana, etc.

 

[Manatee Diver]

Well completed stage cave, no balance issues with one AL80.

Anyways the way we had it setup, the stage I was breathing was always on the left side.

So start of the dive, stage on the left, and deco bottle on the right. Dumped deco bottle at 20ish. Did dive, dump stage, don stage, shortly before get to deco bottle, switch to back gas, clean up stage and put it on the right side. Pick up deco bottle on left, complete deco.

He also switched to a more team oriented gas switch protocol. Probably a result of him recently completing GUE Cave 1 and 2. I do like it, it gives the other team mate more involvement in the gas switch.