Show some respect... bug hunters at Casino Point

[vistasbelow]

I guess I'm confused by the amount of effort going into protecting just a few hundred feet of Catalina while the rest is being rapped and pillaged daily. Seems that if the general population saw what the rest of the island looked like they'd be more willing to support the MLPA's.

Trust me I'm not in favor of hunting in the park, it just seems to me peoples energy is being mis directed to protect just their back yards.

The protection has to start somewhere, why not the places where people from all over the world can come and enjoy a dive park with easy access and an abundance of sea life. It is good for them, good for California tourism and it is good for the sea life.

 

[merxlin]

I guess I'm confused by the amount of effort going into protecting just a few hundred feet of Catalina while the rest is being rapped and pillaged daily. Seems that if the general population saw what the rest of the island looked like they'd be more willing to support the MLPA's.

Trust me I'm not in favor of hunting in the park, it just seems to me peoples energy is being mis directed to protect just their back yards.

The dive park is not the only area we are trying to designate in the MLPAs. There are other areas up by Two Harbors (Isthmus) and further west as well. On the flip side, fishing groups are organizing to oppose (some any and all) MLPA action. Backed by corporations like Shimano (who makes and sells fishing gear), that makes our grass roots effort a much tougher one. Catalina and the MLPA's

But the underlying sentiment seems to be its only a small portion so who cares. I care, many of us who dive the park care. And it is a unique location- one of the only on the island accessible without having to take a charter boat, and is land based. Take the Express, hang out for the day, or spend time staying on the island. They built freakin' stairs for easier entry and exit for goodness sake. Air fills are available. It really is one of the few spots that caters to divers.

I'm willing to bet Cody that you do not see the value in the dive park. Maybe you've never been there. That's too bad.

And whether or not the bugs were taken at the park, dismembering them underwater is illegal and against F&G regs. There is also evidence that the area is poached (taking out of season). So again, the general attitude is a lack of respect for an area that if we don;t do something to protect it, will be gone. And that would be a bigger crime in my opinion, even though it would not be "illegal".

So yes, we are speaking out about "our back yard", but only because of a trend in the people using the park no longer appreciating what they have. But I'll be damned if I will sit by and watch as it gets decimated by a selfish few.

""All that needs to happen for evil to prevail is that good men do nothing."

 

[Codyjp]

The dive park is not the only area we are trying to designate in the MLPAs. There are other areas up by Two Harbors (Isthmus) and further west as well. On the flip side, fishing groups are organizing to oppose (some any and all) MLPA action. Backed by corporations like Shimano (who makes and sells fishing gear), that makes our grass roots effort a much tougher one. Catalina and the MLPA's

But the underlying sentiment seems to be its only a small portion so who cares. I care, many of us who dive the park care. And it is a unique location- one of the only on the island accessible without having to take a charter boat, and is land based. Take the Express, hang out for the day, or spend time staying on the island. They built freakin' stairs for easier entry and exit for goodness sake. Air fills are available. It really is one of the few spots that caters to divers.

I'm willing to bet Cody that you do not see the value in the dive park. Maybe you've never been there. That's too bad.

And whether or not the bugs were taken at the park, dismembering them underwater is illegal and against F&G regs. There is also evidence that the area is poached (taking out of season). So again, the general attitude is a lack of respect for an area that if we don;t do something to protect it, will be gone. And that would be a bigger crime in my opinion, even though it would not be "illegal".

So yes, we are speaking out about "our back yard", but only because of a trend in the people using the park no longer appreciating what they have. But I'll be damned if I will sit by and watch as it gets decimated by a selfish few.

""All that needs to happen for evil to prevail is that good men do nothing."

Completely the contrary. I dive there several times a year and enjoy it.

Unfortunately, I don't think the audience that needs to hear this is going to be browsing online forums, nor will they appreciate an appeal for moral values.

 

[ligersandtions]

Why do you need to hunt in this park ?

I haven't heard a reasonable argument yet as to why there, and not outside it


I see that most (if not everyone) has said they wouldn't hunt there ... so who is doing it?

I don't think anyone needs to hunt in the dive park. I don't think anyone in this thread has even said that they wanted to hunt in the dive park.

Sure, I like that people don't hunt in the park....I like that the marine life is not skittish for the most part (fwiw, I can't honestly believe that a few people grabbing lobsters has made a huge change in all of the lobsters' behavior....I haven't seen it myself, but I'm pretty skeptical).

The thing is, I'm not going to whine and complain about it if it's something that people can legally do. Just like we can hunt PV, Vet's, Malibu, Catalina off a boat....those who wish to hunt at the dive park can, as long as they're doing it legally (i.e. adhering to limits, keeping the lobsters whole until consumption, etc). I'm with Cody, though....I highly doubt some tourist is coming to the dive park with all their gear in tow plus a cooler to keep the lobsters fresh till they can get home. I'd have to guess it's someone local hunting....cause it's an easy location to hunt at (easy access, easy entry, easy to find lobsters....easy).

But really, don't interpret this the wrong way....I'm not saying people should hunt in the park....just simply that I don't believe in telling someone they can't or shouldn't when they legally can.

 

[Rainer]

The protection has to start somewhere

The best and easiest place to start is with one's own actions. If you truly care about lobsters at dive sites, this is simple, don't hunt. Period.

But the hypocrisy of some in this thread who hunt at some sites (ones at which I'd like to see more lobsters, not less), but don't want it to happen in others, is pretty laughable. How about starting in with your own behavior before dictating to others where they may be able to hunt (legally).

Making a big to do about this tiny area, but not concerning yourself with the bigger picture is missing the forest for the trees. Applying a NIMBY attitude to the dive park while you stock up on lobsters at other sites strikes me as rather odd.

 

[merxlin]

Completely the contrary. I dive there several times a year and enjoy it.

Unfortunately, I don't think the audience that needs to hear this is going to be browsing online forums, nor will they appreciate an appeal for moral values.

Obviously we do need to speak here as even divers don't agree on the subject.

And what is this if not a moral question- All who have stated so are correct- it is legal to hunt in the park. The question is should you hunt in the park? Are your actions dictated by the letter of the law, or by what you consider to be right?

I do not hunt for my own reasons. I understand hunting and think that as long as it is controlled and done responsibly, it is a reasonable activity. I do not see any hypocrisy here, as not everything is an all or nothing question.

 

[merxlin]

The best and easiest place to start is with one's own actions. If you truly care about lobsters at dive sites, this is simple, don't hunt. Period.

But the hypocrisy of some in this thread who hunt at some sites (ones at which I'd like to see more lobsters, not less), but don't want it to happen in others, is pretty laughable. How about starting in with your own behavior before dictating to others where they may be able to hunt (legally).

Making a big to do about this tiny area, but not concerning yourself with the bigger picture is missing the forest for the trees. Applying a NIMBY attitude to the dive park while you stock up on lobsters at other sites strikes me as rather odd.

As mentioned, I don't hunt. But again why does it need to be all or nothing? People have proven that without some constraints we will take every last resource we can. Want to see more lobster in the areas you like? Then get active and do something to help promote protecting them. You know what will never help keep more lobster there? Doing nothing.

There is an entire coastline of Catalina that for the most part is unprotected and legal for hunting. I'll reverse the logic: what difference does it make if we protect 300 yards of coastline when you have the entire rest of the island to hunt?

I applaud those that hunt but have taken it upon themselves to recognize that taking in this one small area is no challenge, and does, in my opinion more harm than good. They have put what is best for a whole group of people ahead of their own personal wants.

I will trade my perceived NIMBY attitude for a "I'll do it because I can" attitude any day.

 

[Rainer]

You know what will never help keep more lobster there? Doing nothing.

There is an entire coastline of Catalina that for the most part is unprotected and legal for hunting. I'll reverse the logic: what difference does it make if we protect 300 yards of coastline when you have the entire rest of the island to hunt?

You know what will keep lobster everywhere? Not hunting at all. Why don't you get on board with something that would make a real difference, as opposed to championing the cause of keeping around five people a year from hunting in an area of a few hundred square feet.? This is some seriously disingenuous concern for the environment! It's nothing more than a selfish desire for some to be able to see lobsters in one spot, while they snag from another. Yes, that's hyprocrisy.

I applaud those that hunt but have taken it upon themselves to recognize that taking in this one small area is no challenge, and does, in my opinion more harm than good. They have put what is best for a whole group of people ahead of their own personal wants.

What would truly be best for the lobsters would be to end non-sustenance hunting everywhere. Do you applaud that cause as well?

Even as a vegetarian, that's not what *I'm* calling for. I respect others legal right to hunt. If I want to become a true activist for my beliefs, I'll try to ban hunting for all. But, I recognize that starting with personal action and rationally making my case to others is a better approach (at least for me).

 

[Teamcasa]

The best and easiest place to start is with one's own actions. If you truly care about lobsters at dive sites, this is simple, don't hunt. Period.

We agree on this and as such I have not hunted or harvested any marine life for many years. And, I'd be thrilled is no one ever did. On the flip side, I support their right hunt/harvest, within the rules.

But the hypocrisy of some in this thread who hunt at some sites (ones at which I'd like to see more lobsters, not less), but don't want it to happen in others, is pretty laughable. How about starting in with your own behavior before dictating to others where they may be able to hunt (legally).

Making a big to do about this tiny area, but not concerning yourself with the bigger picture is missing the forest for the trees. Applying a NIMBY attitude to the dive park while you stock up on lobsters at other sites strikes me as rather odd.

I make no bones about it, I have my own selfish reason for keeping hunters out of the park. I want to see more life in it when I'm diving there. So what? Besides, making a comment about the park is a bit NIMBY but then again, most regulations start out somewhere, usually in someones back yard.

I have written CFG more than once and will continue to do so until the the dive park is designated a no-take zone but I will not harass anyone doing it legally. (I may however, ridicule them a little. )

 

[Captain12Pk]

You know what will keep lobster everywhere? Not hunting at all. Why don't you get on board with something that would make a real difference, as opposed to championing the cause of keeping around five people a year from hunting in an area of a few hundred square feet.? This is some seriously disingenuous concern for the environment! It's nothing more than a selfish desire for some to be able to see lobsters in one spot, while they snag from another. Yes, that's hyprocrisy.



What would truly be best for the lobsters would be to end non-sustenance hunting everywhere. Do you applaud that cause as well?

Even as a vegetarian, that's not what *I'm* calling for. I respect others legal right to hunt. If I want to become a true activist for my beliefs, I'll try to ban hunting for all. But, I recognize that starting with personal action and rationally making my case to others is a better approach (at least for me).

...and who is to determine how much a person "needs" to sustain?