Should PADI change Advanced Open Water Diver Standards?

[uncleavi]

I think if PADI taught to a level equal to BUDS and First aid to EMT-P, Folks would still have somthing to complain about.

 

[Thalassamania]

SSI Continuing Education Ratings

The navigation is not the best. Advanced Adventurer and Advanced Diver are complete different programs, that's really gonna help keep things clear and simple.

 

[stimpy4242]

If there is a substantial change in the standards to make the requirements more demanding, those with the current AOW certification cannot be distinguished from those who would complete "revised" AOW. If the AOW is used as a filter by operators to determine whether someone is supposedly qualified to go on a certain dive, then it will be problematic.

Nah i think this is traditionally handled under the term grandfathering, regardless of the industry. Its just how it is. Like there are much different requirements for med school then back then, but it doesn't mean those doctors back then are any less...probably more...and again, I am sure the people who have had AOW for a while now probably have much more experience to back them...so you would just have to bite the bullet there.

 

[Thalassamania]

Then name, specifically the "Advanced" part is what generally seems to attact the most attention.

I see a problem with changing the standards, but not the name. If there is a substantial change in the standards to make the requirements more demanding, those with the current AOW certification cannot be distinguished from those who would complete "revised" AOW. If the AOW is used as a filter by operators to determine whether someone is supposedly qualified to go on a certain dive, then it will be problematic.

A new certification "name" should be associated with the "revised" standards. Don't tell this to PADI or they may create yet another level.

In any event, I agree with Walter - PADI is happy with it like it is.

PADI was not worried about that when the lowered their standards why would they worry about it if they raised them? Not that that is going to happen, it never has and I doubt if it ever will.

 

[garyfotodiver]

SSI does not have an AOW course.

Gee, Walter, I took a course, made up of several different classes. Plus I showed evidence of having a minimum number of dives. This came from the SSI website:

"SSI Advanced Open Water Diver
SSI’s Advanced Diver rating stands alone in the industry with the highest combination of diving knowledge and experience. No other agency’s advanced diver level compares. To earn the certification for Advanced Open Water Diver, you must complete 4 specialty courses and have done a total of 24 dives."

I am sorry if you do not approve of my English skills. If you like, I'll send you a copy of my SSI AOW card.

 

[ucfdiver]

Who cares what it says, it's a way to get an extra $150 from you.

 

[Shaneinpenang]

It doesn't matter what the name of the certification is, it could be called "Super Fantasic Best Ever Scuba Diver", as long as everyone in the industry knows what is involved in the certification process. If someone comes to me with a "Super Fantastic Best Ever" cert card and I know that that cert may have been acchieved in only 9 dives, I'm going expect that they have the skills of someone that has only done nine dives.

I've seen OW students who looked like they'd been diving for years, and I've seen instructors that looked like OW students. It's what you do in the water that counts, not what your cert card says.

 

[Noboundaries]

I feel strongly about the certification process due to my professional aviation background. I'm PADI certified, but I'm not happy with the educational matrix for experience development in the PADI certification levels. The cost doesn't bug me one bit. What bugs me is that it is apparent that marketing and profit decisions are driving the non-pro based certification process at PADI. History and the courts have proven the folly of allowing marketing and profit decisions to override common sense and professionalism. Unfortunately, due to human nature's tendency to follow the path of least resistance, nothing will change until the someone links those decisions in court to an event involving personal injury or death. If successfully linked, those decisions open a Pandora's Box of legislation, increased costs, and loss of control. It is much smarter to be proactive and realize the potential pitfalls of marketing and profit decisions on certifications before Pandora's curse is unleashed.

On another planet where I have influence, here are the changes I'd make in PADI's certification process:

Open Water is fine, but it is only as good as what you put into it and failure should be a real possibility. My personal experience is that everyone passes, period.

AOW should be called Intermediate OW. Keep the same Adventure Dive requirements. It is after all designed for experience and exposure, but it is seriously misnamed in its current state and ripe grounds for a lawsuit.

Advanced OW should require the completion of five mandatory basis skill specialties: Navigation, Peak Buoyancy, Boat, Night, and Deep. Your logbook could have as few as 18-23 dives, but your education would be much more complete. (See SSI's AOW requirements in an earlier post).

Master (also seriously misnamed in its current form) would require you to complete Rescue Diver, Equipment Specialist, two more specialties of your choice and 25 logged dives in each of those chosen specialties. Your Master C-card would spell out your two Master specialties and give your diving a purpose, direction, and goal. Your logbook would have a minimum of 75 total dives.

From this base of Master dive experience, you could then branch out to DM, instructor, etc, adding Master specialites as you desired.

Of course you could just get your OW and skip the rest and save the money the specialites cost. Dive operators and boats would still probably let you dive. This all reminds me of what it takes to get a driver's license in the US, which is pretty much a joke. The one advantage the DMV has is that you have to at least take a written test every few years to keep your license. Nothing like that exists for non-professional divers. Wonder how PADI and the other certifying agencies missed the potential income stream from expiring c-cards?

With 20 million divers in the world, it is only a matter of time before someone brings a lawsuit against a certifying agency for their standards. Has it happened yet? I'll bet someone here knows.

 

[stimpy4242]

The one advantage the DMV has is that you have to at least take a written test every few years to keep your license.

What state do you live in? I live in maryland and I wish that was the law. just an eye test here

 

[Walter]

Gee, Walter, I took a course, made up of several different classes. Plus I showed evidence of having a minimum number of dives.

You did not. You took several courses. After successfully completing them and showing 24 logged dives, you bought an advanced card.