Shadow Divers – Exposed U 869

[JeffG]

We divers owe Gary Gentile a debt of appreciation for setting the record straight, and limiting the damage that Shadow Divers has perpetrated upon history and our sport.

It must be nice to go through life being so gullible.

 

[H2Andy]

p. 196 Shadow Divers Exposed, Gary Gentile:

"Shadow Divers gave credit to Chatterton for finding the body of Mark Ruggiero on the Texas Tower, when in fact Kevin England and John Moyer found the body". Just another example of falsification of the facts to create a 'hero' for the story.:11:

yadda yadda yadda. England and Moyer might have "found" the body, but it was Chatterton who brought it up. and he went down twice to do it. and honestly, i have no idea what England and Moyer have to say about this. all i have is Gary's hearsay, which, again, i don't exactly trust.

is Gary disputing even that?

and, conviniently, Gentile never said anything about these horrible miscarriages of justice until after the money train passed him by ...

i think this is someone trying to cash in on somebody elses good fortune through inuendo and character assasination

 

[amascuba]

We divers owe Gary Gentile a debt of appreciation for setting the record straight, and limiting the damage that Shadow Divers has perpetrated upon history and our sport.

How much is Gary paying you to be a mindless monkey? I want some of that action.

 

[tonka97]

Ho Chi Minh's photo belongs in the scrap heap of history.

Quote and paraphrasing from: Shadow Divers Exposed, p. 159, 160, Gary Gentile, http://www.ggentile.com/sdexposed.html

"On page 44 Shadow Divers, it was written, "There were no experienced 230 foot divers in 1991". On page 93, 230 feet was called "crazy deep". Page 157, the wreck was "lunatic dangerous".

Can we believe Shadow Divers? The above certainly creates a mind-set of awe for the 'heroes' of our story.

But the d**ned truth gets in the way. (Sorry Ho Chi Minh).

The facts indicate that the above quotes are even more obfuscations from the Three Stooges Cookbook author. http://www.amazon.com/Official-Three-Stooges-Cookbook/dp/0809229293

Paraphrased from Gentile, p. 160

1950's Cousteau habitually dived deeper than 230 feet, and so did his companions.
1960: John Light made many dives to depths between 245 and 275 feet on Lusitania.
1966/7: Mike de Camp organized the first two recreational dive trips to Andrea Doria, avg depth 240 feet.
1970s: Deep shipwreck diving trips continued, (Lichtman's Dive Shop did it for a decade)
1980s: Deep wreck-diving was well established. By end of 80s dives to Andrea Doria were routine, both inside and outside the hull.
1981: Billy Deans took divers to Wilkes-Barre, 250 ft, running hundreds of trips to the wreck site. By 1991, he had personally logged several hundred dives on the Wilkes-Barre.
And so on, including many divers exploring the Monitor, 230 feet.

Great Lakes divers that dove 250 feet for more than a decade (in the late 80s) included: Paul Ehorn, Tom Farnquist, Ryan LeBlanc, Emmett Moneyhun, Gary Shumbarger, and Charlie Tulip. This group was only a tiny fraction of the deep wreck divers active throughout the decade.

Gentile indicates that this list of divers doesn't even touch the hundreds of Florida cave divers who were exceeding 230 feet on a daily basis, and who had been doing so for many years. Nor does it include divers from other countries!

Shadow Divers was written for the gullible and ill-informed masses. Don't fall for the baloney!:no Wait, I think Kurson has a 3 Stooges Baloney sandwich recipe!!

 

[H2Andy]

dude, Gary loves to take that statement out of context. in Bill Nagle's circle of divers, there were no experienced divers who could go down to 230 feet. even Doria divers seldom went that deep, with a few making one or two 250 foot dives per year.

he only knew of one diver who went to that depth regularly: Chatterton. and so it was Chatterton he asked for help. maybe Gary should ask himself why Nagle didn't ask him (Gentile) for help... hmmmm?

sure a bunch of other people had done that sort of diving before, but Nagle either didn't know about them or he couldn't exactly ask them for help, given their location, prestige, or whatever.

this type of twisting of meaning to find a "lie" is just abhorrent

it is the worst sort of "lawyering" and i just hate it

 

[JeffG]

Shadow Divers was written for the gullible and ill-informed masses. Don't fall for the baloney!:no

I have a bridge to sell you. That way you will have a home.


LOL, you are funny.

 

[JeffG]

dude, Gary loves to take that statement out of context. in Bill Nagel's circle of divers, there were no experienced divers who could go down to 230 feet. even Doria divers seldom went that deep.

he only knew of one, Chatterton. and so Chatterton he asked.

You should hear what they used to call Gary. Its pretty funny and not flattering at all.

 

[seekercrew]

Here here Andy. If Tonka had read my post he would at least debate my assertion that Chatterton was pulling the strings as far as Bill went. I mean Bogen discovered the wreck so none of these guys deserve any credit! Its long been held physical proof is the standard in positively identify wrecks. Nobody except John Yurga and maybe Dan Crowell did the bottom time on this wreck that John did.The research I don't have personal knowledge of but considering Gary was just plain wrong with the facts I pointed out it's not a stretch he's wrong here. Your quote just highlights the fantasy that John had nothing to do with anything. It was gereraly accepted the wreck was 869. But John was driven for whatever reason to make it positive. I mean if Gary's motives were all that pure why does he argue what he seems to think he has nailed multiple times in the book. Did he forget he already coved his point of view. Or did he figure if he kept repeating the same thing, his dedicated readers would think gee I've heard this before. It must be true!

Again it's Gary's statement if any testimony is false, by legal standards (and Gary's) everything must be ignored. By his own standard his book is also trash. He's absolutly wrong on many points.

 

[tonka97]

Strange, in my copy of Shadow Divers, p. 44 it reads without qualification:

"There were no experienced 230-foot divers in 1991. Even those brave enough to test the Andrea Doria almost never went to her bottom, at 250 feet, blah blah blah"

Nyuk, Nyuk, Nyuk

Hey, don't get me wrong, I like the Three Stooges!!

 

[H2Andy]

obviously, the statement is limited to the immediate circle in the area ...

out of context, it makes no sense, and is easily twisted.

of course, if you think Nagle hadn't heard of Cousteau or Deans...

boy oh boy

Hey, don't get me wrong, I like the Three Stooges!!

oh, obviously

you pattern yourself after them admirably