ScubaPro Jet Fins made in Taiwan

[Karl_H]

Sorry but I beg to differ, I had 2 exact same size Jet fins side by side today, one made in the Us and the other Taiwan, they are not the same, the pocket on the Taiwan Jets is wider, the rubber is softer and they are not as stiff.

I have two XL jets fins (one made in US and one made in Taiwan) side by side right now, they are the same? Unfortunately there are also a lot of knock-off dive products coming out of Taiwan, it may be worth checking exactly which factory they came from. Honestly, they are (well, should) be the same! It may be worth checking your local dealer didn't buy a batch of lemons at a knock-down rate?

---------- Post Merged at 09:12 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 09:09 PM ----------

Anyone knocking Taiwan should understand that it is not a cheap knock off country. Taiwan is a world leader in high tech.

just for reference, of all the knock-off gear available here in the Philippines, 90% comes from Taiwan, it's probably the world leader of knock-off dive equipment. Although it also produces some good equipment too, but it certainly has it's fair share of knock-offs.

The real danger is the knock-off stuff looks incredibly like the original stuff at first glance.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

The rubber compound has been the key to the Jet Fin's success and Scubapro knows that. If you got a pair that are too soft, send them back, I'm sure SP will replace them. And I'm sure they'd want to know about a quality assurance issue with the compound, regardless of where it was made.

And, IMHO, if the foot pocket on the Taiwan made Jets is a little wider, it would be an improvement, not something to bitch about.

------

Tiawan is not China, and China is a great example of why some products just won't be made in the US anymore. Apple for example was a solid made in America company for years, but moved production of the screens on the iPhone 4 to China. Jobs wanted a glass screen and getting that designed, tooled and produced in the US would have taken the better part of six months a and cost a comparative fortune. In China, the design was cranked out in days, the factory tooled and workers trucked in to live in dorms to produce them and the glass screen was in production in about 2 weeks.

US companies just can't offer that degree of flexibility and speed, and American workers are not going to be willing to go live in a dorm somewhere working a 6 day week for what would compare to minimum wage.

At the other extreme there is Germany - a country that made a conscious decision to hold on to high tech precision industries and adopted labor and education policies to ensure a strong, well trained, well paid and viable work force for those industries. Companies that locate or remain there, accept the rather restrictive and expensive labor and benefits standards but recognize that they are also receiving excellent value in return for the higher wages and benefits.

In contrast, if you posed that argument here in the US (where we talk about high tech jobs and creating a skilled labor force, but won't pay for it) the conservatives (of either party) and business interests would scream "socialism!" and wail and cry about how it will kill the ability for companies to expand and be successful and how it will stop companies and investors from creating new jobs. They will of course leave out the part about creating new jobs in China as the wages are a lot lower there (as are environmental standards and associated costs) so that they can boost their profit margin by moving production offshore while maintaing the same MSRP on those products.

So..if you don't like Jet Fins being produced overseas, keep that in mind when you vote and start thinking about more than the hot button single issues that are used to take attention away from the larger economic and business issues that effect us all.

 

[buddhasummer]

The rubber compound has been the key to the Jet Fin's success and Scubapro knows that. If you got a pair that are too soft, send them back, I'm sure SP will replace them. And I'm sure they'd want to know about a quality assurance issue with the compound, regardless of where it was made.

And, IMHO, if the foot pocket on the Taiwan made Jets is a little wider, it would be an improvement, not something to bitch about.

------

Tiawan is not China, and China is a great example of why some products just won't be made in the US anymore. Apple for example was a solid made in America company for years, but moved production of the screens on the iPhone 4 to China. Jobs wanted a glass screen and getting that designed, tooled and produced in the US would have taken the better part of six months a and cost a comparative fortune. In China, the design was cranked out in days, the factory tooled and workers trucked in to live in dorms to produce them and the glass screen was in production in about 2 weeks.

US companies just can't offer that degree of flexibility and speed, and American workers are not going to be willing to go live in a dorm somewhere working a 6 day week for what would compare to minimum wage.

At the other extreme there is Germany - a country that made a conscious decision to hold on to high tech precision industries and adopted labor and education policies to ensure a strong, well trained, well paid and viable work force for those industries. Companies that locate or remain there, accept the rather restrictive and expensive labor and benefits standards but recognize that they are also receiving excellent value in return for the higher wages and benefits.

In contrast, if you posed that argument here in the US (where we talk about high tech jobs and creating a skilled labor force, but won't pay for it) the conservatives (of either party) and business interests would scream "socialism!" and wail and cry about how it will kill the ability for companies to expand and be successful and how it will stop companies and investors from creating new jobs. They will of course leave out the part about creating new jobs in China as the wages are a lot lower there (as are environmental standards and associated costs) so that they can boost their profit margin by moving production offshore while maintaing the same MSRP on those products.

So..if you don't like Jet Fins being produced overseas, keep that in mind when you vote and start thinking about more than the hot button single issues that are used to take attention away from the larger economic and business issues that effect us all.

Except the US ones I tried on in a shop fitted nicely but they were shop demos so I had to order a pair, when they arrived I noticed the differences and for my foot the wider pocket is a problem.

---------- Post Merged at 12:01 AM ---------- Previous Post was at 12:01 AM ----------

Originally Posted by SCUBAPRO Harry
Overseas manufacturing began just about one year ago. The foot pockets and size dimensions are copied identical to the US versions and the durometer is to be the same. However, L, XL, and XXL are the only sizes available; M and XXXL are only available from the USA.



Thank you for taking the time to reply.

I cannot speak to other sizes, but the Large USA version and the Large Taiwan version are NOT the same. As I stated above the foot pocket on the Taiwanese version is larger (wider) and they are definitely not the same "durometer". The Taiwanese Large are significantly softer and less rigid, and not just by a little bit.

I dont know if something has changed since the first production run, but perhaps you can get them to send you some sample so you can compare side by side.

I had the chance to do so again today in a shop which had both models. The owner of the dive store (Japan) went on to tell me that the Japanese market market does not like the Taiwanese version and that he has a hard time selling them. He predicted that within one year Scuba Pro will again be selling the USA version in Japan. He said it's a big problem. This was his opinion so I cannot comment. It's possible that the reasons the Taiwanese Jets are not popular here are more political based, Im not sure.

But again the two Large I had seen side by side are not the same.

And again this is not a comment on the quality of the Taiwanese Jets, just that they are not the same.

 

[Nemrod]

Oh well, glad I have a spare pair and my current ones are still in decent shape. Since they are no longer USA made and appear to be of lower quality and lower quality control and different stiffness and fit. No thanks. Hey Scuba Pro, I will never buy another pair---even if I ever need to.

N

 

[buddhasummer]

Update:


I found some made in the US Large Jet fins online here in Japan so bought them. I have sat here for sometime comparing them at my leisure.

1) They are not the same compound, the Taiwanese Jets are made from a much softer compound. They don't look like they're made from the same material.
2) They are not the same "durometer", the US Jets are significantly stiffer.
3) The foot pocket is wider on the Taiwanese Jets, 11.6cm vs 10.6cm at widest point (outside edge)

So if your looking to pay the same price for a soft floppy US Jet "clone" with a wider pocket go for the Taiwanese Jets other wise avoid them like the plague.

---------- Post Merged at 09:44 AM ---------- Previous Post was at 09:23 AM ----------

I have two XL jets fins (one made in US and one made in Taiwan) side by side right now, they are the same? Unfortunately there are also a lot of knock-off dive products coming out of Taiwan, it may be worth checking exactly which factory they came from. Honestly, they are (well, should) be the same! It may be worth checking your local dealer didn't buy a batch of lemons at a knock-down rate?

---------- Post Merged at 09:12 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 09:09 PM ----------



just for reference, of all the knock-off gear available here in the Philippines, 90% comes from Taiwan, it's probably the world leader of knock-off dive equipment. Although it also produces some good equipment too, but it certainly has it's fair share of knock-offs.

The real danger is the knock-off stuff looks incredibly like the original stuff at first glance.

Always possible I guess but I bought them from a large and and well know brick and mortar shop who are ScubaPro dealers so probably not the case.

 

[danvolker]

DEMA should have a MADE IN USA booth !

 

[Nemrod]

DEMA should have a MADE IN USA booth !

It isn't so much the Made In USA though buying from my countryman is a bonus but that when I purchase something it is the real thing and not a clone even if the clone is marketed by the original maker. I have no problem purchasing goods from fair market/free market/ fair wage democracies including Taiwan where that is applicable. However, Nationalist China now ensconced on Taiwan is China, just not Communist Red China, just ask the ChiComs if it is China or not. One day they are going to step across that strait, or at least give it a go, depends on what the USN has to say about it at the time.

N

 

[danvolker]

I think America was a better country for it's people, and it's work force, back in the 50's and 60's-- prior to the Unions getting out of hand, and large businesses getting pissed, and moving to other countries, or outsourcing.
If we had had much better leadership, "right to work" concepts would have blocked Union excesses and damages, and programs would have been created by businesses to reward workers for higher quality and better work product, than the average. Our productivity would have gone up, so we could still have reasonable pricing.
Instead, the corporations and businesses made terrible choices, and the unions made terrible choices.

I think MANY Americans would prefer to give their money to a neighbor ( an American), than to some stranger far away, that is actually competing with Americans--with your neighbors.

Advertising has driven the mistake ( globalization) to where it is today. The Internet , social media, and word of mouth are really the only hope for reversing this in the future. Government has already become globalist, and will not help. Ron Paul might have, but given the news medias are owned by globalist corporations, even when Ron Paul "knocks one out of the park" in a debate, the news coverage is there to play this down, ignore it, or spin this back to the mainstream.

America has a News Media that the Nazi Propagandists of World War II, would have been very jealous of. Seriously.

 

[ams511]

DEMA should have a MADE IN USA booth !

They do. It is called Deep Sea Supply.

---------- Post Merged at 09:24 AM ---------- Previous Post was at 09:11 AM ----------

I have two XL jets fins (one made in US and one made in Taiwan) side by side right now, they are the same? Unfortunately there are also a lot of knock-off dive products coming out of Taiwan, it may be worth checking exactly which factory they came from. Honestly, they are (well, should) be the same! It may be worth checking your local dealer didn't buy a batch of lemons at a knock-down rate?

I forget which company this happened to maybe someone remembers. However years ago a dive company rejected a shipment of regulators because of poor quality control. The OEM then proceeded to sell the regulators themselves. So this could be the same type of situation.

---------- Post Merged at 09:41 AM ---------- Previous Post was at 09:11 AM ----------

I think America was a better country for it's people, and it's work force, back in the 50's and 60's-- prior to the Unions getting out of hand, and large businesses getting pissed, and moving to other countries, or outsourcing.
If we had had much better leadership, "right to work" concepts would have blocked Union excesses and damages, and programs would have been created by businesses to reward workers for higher quality and better work product, than the average. Our productivity would have gone up, so we could still have reasonable pricing.
Instead, the corporations and businesses made terrible choices, and the unions made terrible choices.

Conservatives like to blame the unions for the decline of American industry but that is not the case. First, the majority of American workers were never unionized. Second, factories have closed even in "right to work" states in the South. For example, North Carolina is very pro business, yet textiles and furniture making is moving abroad. Third, we should expect to see a larger decline in Europe as they are highly unionized and the unions are stronger and have more influence. German manufacturing is very strong and they are highly unionized. I can tell you that accounting and legal work is being offshored at an increasing pace and neither of these industries is unionized. It is just that you can get a foreign worker for about 1/3 of the cost of an American one.

 

[Centrals]

The real danger is the knock-off stuff looks incredibly like the original stuff at first glance.

The look alike probably comes across the borderfrom HK!!
In Red China ONLY the fake is genuine.