Scout light or Mini Scout?

[StSomewhere]

What are the specification of DIR light?

Actually that's a great question.

WRT openwater (non-overhead) dives, what are the lighting requirements? Does it vary from bluewater to low vis to night diving? When is a 10 watt HID no longer acceptable?

The type of primary light an individual should consider is certainly going to vary depending on the dive chosen. For more technical dives most divers tend to use a separate battery canister and light head.

 

[Spoon]

Actually that's a great question.

WRT openwater (non-overhead) dives, what are the lighting requirements? Does it vary from bluewater to low vis to night diving? When is a 10 watt HID no longer acceptable?

pretty painful to know when your 10watt hids are no longer acceptable..ouch!

 

[jonnythan]

It needs to have a tight and bright enough beam for signaling in the conditions you're diving, it needs to have a goodman handle.

 

[RTodd]

It needs to have a tight and bright enough beam for signaling in the conditions you're diving, it needs to have a goodman handle.

jonnythan is handling this one quite well. Let me add, you don't need a NiMH HID light for simple open water night dives or even lower vis dives. A 50 watt halogen with sealed lead acid is a lot cheaper and a lot more reliable plus has the added advantage of adding ditchable weight. Given that most people who can afford it have gone to HID, there should be plenty of used ones out there for a great price. I have several HID lights, and every one of them has failed in some manner on me. While I would not go back to a lower output light, if you truly don't need it for cave or wreck, it is still possible to have a DIR style light that does not cost any more than the open water garbage out there.

LED technology just isn't bright enough yet and the huge open water bricks they sell that are HID or whatever can't be stowed in a remotely useful fashion, rarely have a focused enough beam for signalling or letting your buddy know where you are at all times in relation to their position in the water, and keep you from using the hand they are in for anything else.

 

[Spoon]

jonnythan is handling this one quite well. Let me add, you don't need a NiMH HID light for simple open water night dives or even lower vis dives. A 50 watt halogen with sealed lead acid is a lot cheaper and a lot more reliable plus has the added advantage of adding ditchable weight. Given that most people who can afford it have gone to HID, there should be plenty of used ones out there for a great price. I have several HID lights, and every one of them has failed in some manner on me. While I would not go back to a lower output light, if you truly don't need it for cave or wreck, it is still possible to have a DIR style light that does not cost any more than the open water garbage out there.

LED technology just isn't bright enough yet and the huge open water bricks they sell that are HID or whatever can't be stowed in a remotely useful fashion, rarely have a focused enough beam for signalling or letting your buddy know where you are at all times in relation to their position in the water, and keep you from using the hand they are in for anything else.

great explanation. questions answered thanks

 

[Derek S]

Then hopefully he will get his head out of his butt and stop being, forgive the term, a nickel rocket.

You know as well as anyone that DIR doesn't allow for comprimises in gear for personal preference or for the sake of saving a couple of bucks.

You're obviously free to be quasi-DIR in the meantime I suppose.

No nickels here, you know that.

Woah Jon, no need to flog that hard. I was simply asking a question for the benefit of others. You know I own a HID canister light, why the harsh comments?

Maybe I'm missing the context of your post, but considering my level of experience and my place in the DIR hierarchy of skills/classes, I don't think I've made "comprimises in gear for personal preference or for the sake of saving a couple of bucks."

I'll go back to my corner and continue to be quasi-DIR I guess....

 

[RTodd]

No nickels here, you know that.

Woah Jon, no need to flog that hard. I was simply asking a question for the benefit of others. You know I own a HID canister light, why the harsh comments?

Maybe I'm missing the context of your post, but considering my level of experience and my place in the DIR hierarchy of skills/classes, I don't think I've made "comprimises in gear for personal preference or for the sake of saving a couple of bucks."

I'll go back to my corner and continue to be quasi-DIR I guess....

Context, that statement was not harsh at all. It is just the truth. You either dive DIR, which requires a commitment of time, money and effort or you don't. Your choice. There is no quasi-DIR. It tends to take a very clear statement of that fact to get the attention of those new to this concept. People get upset because they don't want to be told they have to make that effort, they want DIR handed to them just like their PADI OW card. It eventually clicks for those that are committed.

 

[Dan Gibson]

It's funny you should mention this. The low prices on Halogen lights was in fact the norm when the HID lights became popular. There were some Pro18s for a little as $100 (good condition) if you searched hard enough. Later, used halogen supplies seemed to dry up a little and the price started going back up since there was a significant enough demand for people to have one as a backup after some of the HID light problems started occuring. I had to pay about $250 for my backup Pro18. Not really a bad price, but I could have picked up several at an even better price had I anticipated this happening. The price may have come down again. I haven't checked lately.

You are definitely right about one thing. It's something many people really don't want to hear. Besides the obvious commitment to time and effort, you really have to be committed to the financial side. That's a hard pill for many to swallow.

A 50 watt halogen with sealed lead acid is a lot cheaper and a lot more reliable plus has the added advantage of adding ditchable weight. Given that most people who can afford it have gone to HID, there should be plenty of used ones out there for a great price.

 

[Derek S]

Context, that statement was not harsh at all. It is just the truth. You either dive DIR, which requires a commitment of time, money and effort or you don't. Your choice. There is no quasi-DIR. It tends to take a very clear statement of that fact to get the attention of those new to this concept. People get upset because they don't want to be told they have to make that effort, they want DIR handed to them just like their PADI OW card. It eventually clicks for those that are committed.

The original intent of my post was to ask if it was DIR for a non-cave, non-wreck penetrating diver to use a light other than a HID canister (a la halogen canister light - not a UK light cannon, ect.) because I wanted it clarified for others. I hadn't heard of DIR divers specifically using halogen, and was curious myself. I already have a HID canister light. Jon knows this, as we've dove together on more than one occasion.

I've never wished DIR to be handed to me, I desire to earn it. It may be a slower road for me than some others, but I am making the effort. Life gets in the way sometimes. Bills must be paid, time must be spent with the family when I'd rather be practicing my skills. Does this make me a bad person or a bad diver per se? I'd like to think not.

If divers are going to be lashed out at when a question is asked (even if it is an honest question by a GUE trained diver), I can see why people would further perpetuate the "elitist" tag we're trying to shed.

 

[lamont]

The original intent of my post was to ask if it was DIR for a non-cave, non-wreck penetrating diver to use a light other than a HID canister (a la halogen canister light - not a UK light cannon, ect.) because I wanted it clarified for others. I hadn't heard of DIR divers specifically using halogen, and was curious myself. I already have a HID canister light. Jon knows this, as we've dove together on more than one occasion.

Before there were HIDs and before there were NiMH there were Halogen lights driven off of SLA cannisters (big ones). Presumably that is still acceptable if you can get one on the cheap and it fits your style of diving. If you can route the long hose under it, and it has sufficient output and burntime for your purpose, then it seems pretty DIR to me. IMO, ask a GUE instructor and not on scubaboard though.