replacing my second stage

[rab1412000]

hi guys

upon great suggestions and tips i deffered from replacing my whole reg setup and instead decided to keep my trusty old mk10. im also moving my 2nd stage glacia as my octo ( my former generic one was usless) and was looking to pair up my mk10 to its rightful partner - an SP g250v.

new g250's are quite expensive still, even after almost 20 years in the market. i was wondering if you guys could suggest other great alternatives as a 2nd thats as competent as the classic that the g250 is. my budget would be less than $175.
some of the things im looking for aside from legendary reliability are small size, ease of service, comfortable bite, and bubbles away from face
thanks in advance

 

[spectrum]

Some of the things im looking for aside from legendary reliability are small size, ease of service, comfortable bite, and bubbles away from face
thanks in advance

It would be a kludge but you described a Sherwood Oasis/Blizzard with the walrus exhaust tee and Wisdom mouthpiece.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

The alternatives to a G250V would be an original G250. Now that the G250V is available they sell for sane money on e-bay in the $80-120 range depending on how bad two people want one at the same time.

Labor for an annual service is about $25 and the parts kit is $15-$20 depending on how much the dealer marks it up, so your total cost would be in the $125 to $165 range.

A Blananced Adjustable is another good option. They sell from $30 to $65 in average condition and really nice ones with excellent chrome and intact silk screened lettering can go for $30 or 40more. Annual service costs are about the same so the total cost for an average BA will range from $75 to $105.

The Balanced Adjustable and older unbalanced "Adjustable" are impossibel to tell apart externally in most cases as many Adjustables were updated to Balanced Adjustable status. The upgrade requires about $4 in parts over and above the normal annual service in most cases and a new lever in the case of a few really early Adjustables which can cost $5 to 10 more.

Performance is essentially identical. Scuabpro took the all metal Balanced Adjustable's internal parts and basically put them in a plastic case to create the G250 and they bioth use the same poppet assembly and annual service parts.

The D400 is another good option with the adtvantage that the mostly rubber case is a lot like the Jet fin - it still looks great after decades of use. It is the best breathing second stage Scubapro ever produced on a widely produced basis and it breathes equally well in any position. It is a bit different to work on and newer techs may not tune it to its potential. Also the later versions had a new aspirator with plastic orifice and a new lever, bth of which hurt the initial inhalation effort. An old D400 or the earlier D350 or D300 will give an inital cracking effort in the .5 to .7 of water range and give a lower sustained flow effort as well. In contrast the late production D400's more often provide a more normal 1.0 to 1.2" inhalation effort with a bot more effort needed to sustain high flow rates. Not bad, but not the exceptional regs the earlier variants were.

They seem to sell in the $75 range on e-bay. Annual service labor is the same, but the parts kit is a bit more - in the $20-$25 range, so the final ready to dive cost would be in the $125 range. They can be a bit fickle and may need a mid season tune up if you tune them for maximum performance. The D400 has a very small exhaust T so bubbles are more of an issue, but frankly, I have always felt bubble interference with vision was a mask issue, not a reg issue. A well designed mask will channel bubbles away from the face plate anyway and I think more peopel notice bubbles now days as so many masks or poorly designed to deal with them.

 

[Fishpie]

Great suggestions from DA.
If you wanted to widen the search to other brands, all models of Zeagle an Apeks 2nd stages are balanced and will perform very well with a Mk10 and be very similar to the g250.

 

[halocline]

some of the things im looking for aside from legendary reliability are small size, ease of service, comfortable bite, and bubbles away from face
thanks in advance

I think I suggested a few used regs in your other thread, although in this one DA Aquamaster really spelled it out for you in great detail. A couple of things to remember: 1) small 2nd stage size is not an advantage, neither is "lightweight". Remember that the reg is filled with air in the water, and so any increase in size/weight is offset by increased water displacement. Comfortable bite is determined by mouthpiece and hose, and that's it. So, whatever you buy, you need to get the right hose set up and the best mouthpiece. For me that's a 5 ft primary hose and a sea cure mouthpiece, but that's a personal decision.

Smaller regs also usually mean smaller exhaust tees. If you're really concerned with bubbles in your face, the only true solution I've found is going with an old double hose, but that's an entirely different diving experience.

Interestingly enough, despite the smaller exhaust tee with the D series, I find that the bubble dispersion is excellent. My guess is that that's because the geometry of the reg puts the exhaust tee more under your chin and less in front of your mouth.

If you're concerned about buying something on ebay, you might find someone on SB who has a collection of excellent-condition 2nd stages that have been well cared for and would be sold expertly serviced.

 

[scubafanatic]

...save yourself some grief and just follow DA Aquamaster's advice ! ...additionally, if possible, don't mix and match brands, it complicates repairs/servicing....keep it all Scubapro.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

I gotta move by the end of July and moving at my house is like moving your personal stuff and a dive shop. So I have seven or so Balanced Adjustables and a few D400's and D300's that I should get rid of.

I am rebuilding one of them in as close to minty condition as I can for a buyer, but I'd part with more if you are interested and could probably make another in a similar near mint condition.

 

[cbmech2]

In your first post, I told you that I purchased my MK10 - G250 Graphite used off of E-bay. I paid 125 bucks for the whole setup, so I am sure that you could probably find a good G250 there without breaking the bank. Good luck.

Here is a guy selling 3 regs and selling each individually for 100 bucks. The link to the auction is below:

http://cgi.ebay.com/SCUBAPRO-G250-SECOUND-STAGE-REGULATOR-OMS-HALCYON_W0QQitemZ320378395991QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item4a980a5d57&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A10%7C3

 

[rab1412000]

I gotta move by the end of July and moving at my house is like moving your personal stuff and a dive shop. So I have seven or so Balanced Adjustables and a few D400's and D300's that I should get rid of.

I am rebuilding one of them in as close to minty condition as I can for a buyer, but I'd part with more if you are interested and could probably make another in a similar near mint condition.

DA how the hell do i PM you regarding the d400 :doh2:
im new to the forums and i am not so familiar with its usage yet.
i am keen on checking the d400's you have. my only concern is that i am from the philippines. i do order from the states online but only through websites such as LP and amazon and never thru e-bay. well at any rate please shoot me an email regarding you reg.
also a local guy is seling me his d400 that has had 100 dives on them, was purchased in 1996, but has been serviced regularly ( at least according to him).
reading your post above this seems to be the year model where the d400's didnt perform as the older ones. at any rate, i am going to check it out this week and since i have not bought a reg second hand could you give me a list of things i should check on this reg.
also, i read in a post that servicing the d400 might be a problem as some new tech's may not be as familiar with it and parts/kits may be scarce. you seem like the resident SP guru in SB, what do you think of this?

 

[DA Aquamaster]

I have had mixed luck with the post 1995 plastic orificed D400s. I had a couple that were great and I had others that were never quite up to par and frankly they were frustrating to work on. replacing the orifice is a start but you have to be very careful when seating it in the aspirator to ensure you do not nick the edge. If it also has the latest lever that in my experience tends to increase the inhalation effot needed to sustain high flow rates - I have seen this as high as 1.8" of water when older D400's need no more than maybe 1.0' to sustain the same flow.

But 1996 is on the bubble, it may have bene made a year or two prior to the actual sale and in most cases SP exhausts older parts before they start assembling with newer parts so it could go either way. it will either breathe very well or it won't.

I'll have to check what I have here for D400's and ensure I have one that produces good inhalation numbers. Otherwise paypal works fine for payment and i can get the shipping cost in advance.