Religion and scuba

[MXGratefulDiver]

For those of us who accept the Biblical account, there's been plenty of demonstration. For those who refuse to believe the evidence is real, they see no evidence. And without religion there seems little to unite humanity aside from self interest. Dangerous? Can be. Can also be quite protective.

Religion is all about self-interest ... eternal life in paradise is an awfully big incentive to get people to behave ...

 

[drrich2]

Actually Christianity calls us to love the Lord our God with all our heart, mind, soul & strength, and neighbor as ourself (not instead of or to the exclusion of, setting a standard for fairness, justice and valuing).

Does it serve the self to seek to reconcile with God in Christ, from a Christian perspective? Yes, deeply so. It's not an either/or proposition.

Richard.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I would never understand why atheists always seek to ridicule religion and God... If you don't believe in it fine that's your right/choice...

Why go there...

Anyways... Logically speaking... If there is a God and believing in him gave you external bliss... So you live your life believing in him while being a good person... Just as any atheist... You die and find out God is not real... Oh well you lose nothing


An atheist however... Dies and realises that maybe there is a God... I think he has more to lose...

If I die and God isn't real... Oh well... You die and God is real... What next

... so for you, God is an insurance agent ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[dfx]

Time for worship! Ramen!

 

[dfx]

Absent religion, that view that human life has inherent value isn't so much a 'learned truth' as it has become a consensus opinion; much like enslaving black people used to be.

Quite right. And somehow, the white population enslaving the black were all deeply religious. Somehow, your god miraculously failed to provide guidance as to how or why this was the wrong thing for them to do. Somehow, those people justified their actions exactly through that bible that you swear on. Weird, huh?

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

There are many 1st hand accounts by recipients of miracles, modern day, in addition to the Biblical account, for those who wish to secure more evidence.

There are many 1st hand accounts of magic too. Miracles, like magic, are nothing more than a person's attempt to explain something for which he or she lacks the knowledge to explain. It's more the result of our limited ability to comprehend the nature of the universe we live in than it is the work of some Almighty Being who watches over us. If such a Being were so watchful, then why all the disaster and tragedy in the world? Particularly those that occur to innocents?

Yes, I know ... God's Will ... like miracles and magic, it's the usual explanation for that which cannot be explained ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

---------- Post added July 15th, 2015 at 06:56 PM ----------

So "faith" means that you are specifically believing something without evidence. Obviously, that's fine if you want to do that, and the vast majority of human beings do just that. But I think that's horrible: to HAVE the ability to test reality, but to refuse to do so.

Faith is the flip side of denial ... both are abilities that most humans are incredibly good at ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[JohnN]

Time for worship! Ramen!

View attachment 212743

Heretic !!!!

The one and true Church of Flying Spaghetti Monster

 

[drrich2]

Quite right. And somehow, the white population enslaving the black were all deeply religious. Somehow, your god miraculously failed to provide guidance as to how or why this was the wrong thing for them to do. Somehow, those people justified their actions exactly through that bible that you swear on. Weird, huh?

The motivation was secular. Religion was rationalized to do two things; bypass what would've otherwise been religious objections to the mistreatment of the slaves at the least, and to justify the slavery. But there's no reason to think that absent religion the Europeans would've abstained from the institution of slavery, which has also existed in non-Christian societies.

Miracles, like magic, are nothing more than a person's attempt to explain something for which he or she lacks the knowledge to explain. It's more the result of our limited ability to comprehend the nature of the universe we live in than it is the work of some Almighty Being who watches over us. If such a Being were so watchful, then why all the disaster and tragedy in the world? Particularly those that occur to innocents?

'Miracle' may be the explanation, at least in as much as it's a term for some of God's acts. As for why bad things happen to 'good' people, this gets back to original sin. Humans aren't innocent or good, except in their own minds/by their own standards. Christians hold that we live in a fallen world. Hence my earlier pointing out that basically, 'this ain't Eden.'

Richard.

 

[dlofting]

Humans aren't innocent or good, except in their own minds/by their own standards.

I honestly can't believe that an all-loving god would see things this way......

 

[phoenix31tt]

... so for you, God is an insurance agent ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

...people hate insurance agents, but they love the security that insurance brings...

I presented an argument based on logic... it has nothing to do with what i believe in...