Regulator failure on a solo deco dive

[SlugLife]

Maybe too hard? That came up at my LDS, as well. It's not something I knew to be aware of until now. Always learning. I'd been using Deep 6 Scribbles without any issues for 3 years before upgrading to Signatures in June of this year.

Question on torque: the tech at my LDS ran off and torqued it to 15 ft/lbs (over 2x spec) before I could find the 80 in/lb number in the manual on my phone. He said that it was the standard for HOG regs and that the Deep 6 looked like a HOG. He and the other tech agreed that 80 in/lbs was not enough. My question: should I back it off to spec? Or has the damage been done (hopefully not)?

If it's already torqued, I'd probably leave it. I don't think any worse damage will occur that hasn't happened already.

I am amazed that there are people finger tightening their LP hoses! I’ve been diving over 60 years now, and have never had a LP (or HP for that matter) hose come loose. Why? Will, I use a wrench to tighten them down. I see no reason whatsoever to have the LP hoses only finger tight. Is that done so that they can be removed underwater? ‘Doesn’t seem reasonable to me at all.

Now, about the DIN connector; I don’t dive DIN regulators. But it seems that the wheel needs only to be hand tight when putting it onto a tank, as the seal is still an O-ring seal, right? But the wheel attachment to the regulator first stage needs to be tightened to specs. Am I missing something here?

SeaRat

That is what caused my incident. I followed that advice from others to only make hoses hand-tight, which resulted in a hose coming loose and a pricey 2nd stage lost somewhere on the bottom of the lake. Proper hose-tightness (for anyone reading) is first hand-tight, and then a little more with a tool. I don't know the torque-spec, but it's not that much. Just enough that the hose doesn't come loose.

I don't think anywhere in this thread anyone was saying hoses only finger tight.. maybe I missed it? I was talking about the din wheel being finger tight.

Fwiw, I use wrenches too. Not crazy, just 1/8 snug or so. Enough it can't come loose. Same for plugs.

Not in this thread, but I've encountered "hand tight hose" advice before.

 

[Bigbella]

Now, about the DIN connector; I don’t dive DIN regulators. But it seems that the wheel needs only to be hand tight when putting it onto a tank, as the seal is still an O-ring seal, right? But the wheel attachment to the regulator first stage needs to be tightened to specs. Am I missing something here?

It doesn't require a great deal of torque to seat a captive o-ring, and once that regulator is pressurized, it is going nowhere; but my DIN connectors are always tightly hand-attached -- certainly beyond that of hoses or blind screws, which are typically only tightened to about 6 nm +/- 1 specs, according to the manuals . . .

 

[Bigbella]

Question on torque: the tech at my LDS ran off and torqued it to 15 ft/lbs (over 2x spec) before I could find the 80 in/lb number in the manual on my phone. He said that it was the standard for HOG regs and that the Deep 6 looked like a HOG. He and the other tech agreed that 80 in/lbs was not enough. My question: should I back it off to spec? Or has the damage been done (hopefully not)

Can that possibly be right, without some conversion error somewhere?

80 inch pounds, if that's what we're talking about, is only about 9 nm -- far too loose for any connection stem and little more, really, than the tightness of blind screws at 6; and 80 foot pounds is almost 109 nm -- more than three and a half times the tightest torque specifications of any of my regulators, at 30 nm -- and really entering the automotive realm, in terms of torque.

For example, a lug nut is usually tightened to between 70 and 80 foot pounds.

That's a lot to expect of brass, which could be easily destroyed by just the clumsy use of o-ring removers and dental picks . . .

 

[Thrutch]

Damn!

Can that possibly be right, without some conversion error somewhere?

80 foot pounds is already almost 109 nm -- more than three and a half times the tightest torque specifications of any of my regulators, at 30 nm -- and really entering the automotive realm, in terms of torque. For example, a lug nut is usually tightened to between 70 and 80 foot pounds.

That's a lot to expect of brass, which could be easily destroyed by just the clumsy use of o-ring removers and dental picks . . .

Sorry, I was confusingly switching back and forth between inch and foot pounds. Spec is 6.7 ft/lbs (9 nm). Shop tightened to 15 ft/lbs (20 nm). Annoying, but not that level of catastrophic.

 

[Bigbella]

Sorry, I was confusingly switching back and forth between inch and foot pounds. Spec is 6.7 ft/lbs (9 nm). Shop tightened to 15 ft/lbs (20 nm). Annoying, but not that level of catastrophic.

"9 nm" specifications for what -- the connection stem? That strikes me as far too loose.

Mine are all set to specs at 22 ft/lbs -- about 30 nm.

Just be a bit cynical of some manuals and their conversions. My Poseidon Atmosphere (FFM) repair manual offers a "maximum operational depth of 50 meters" which the Swedes have converted, no joke, to 656 feet!

Yeah, and Americans have problems with the metric system.

That error has remained in the manual for just the last twenty years . . .

 

[Thrutch]

"9 nm" specifications for what -- the connection stem? That strikes me as far too loose.

If we're talking about the same thing, they call it the DIN retainer:

 

[Bigbella]

If we're talking about the same thing, they call it the DIN retainer:
View attachment 760417

Yeah, I think that we are.

Various manufacturers have different names for much the same thing; but I wonder if there's an error, since mine are routinely tightened at more than three times that figure; so too many other makes, that come to mind . . .

 

[Thrutch]

Yeah, I think that we are.

Various manufacturers have different names for much the same thing; but I wonder if there's an error, since mine are routinely tightened at more than twice that figure; so too many other makes, that come to mind . . .

Interesting. Less annoyed with my local techs now. @rob.mwpropane also said 80 in/lbs for this reg. Maybe it's an outlier?

 

[Bigbella]

Interesting. Less annoyed with my local techs now. @rob.mwpropane also said 80 in/lbs for this reg. Maybe it's an outlier?

Or an error? I just cannot imagine so little torque on that piece -- though am now, sadly, not surprised that it came loose.

Here's a chart of routine torque settings, for the Poseidon Xstream . . .

 

[rob.mwpropane]

Interesting. Less annoyed with my local techs now. @rob.mwpropane also said 80 in/lbs for this reg. Maybe it's an outlier?

That's what is in the manual

Or an error? I just cannot imagine so little torque on that piece -- though am now, sadly, not surprised that it came loose.

Here's a chart of routine torque settings, for the Poseidon Xstream . . .

Aren't Poseidon's like a completely different animal though? (I've never owned one, but have heard they're different).