Regulator failure on a solo deco dive

[happy-diver]

What's all that noise, how do y'all invent such convoluted rubbish is this called thinking aloud for no result

Great job you don't know your gear jumped into the water anyway, with busted stuff, you deserve a medal


Was it Colonel Mustard in the workshop with the spanner or Miss Scarlett by Lake Tahoe with the lead pipe

again polluting the Solo forum with non Solo dogma

 

[SlugLife]

Glad it all worked out fine. I carry a small mirror on every dive, and has come in handy a couple of times.

Gas availability is one big advantage to BM doubles, in my opinion.

DW

Based on my experience with a regulator-hose coming loose from the 2nd stage underwater, the amount of bubbles makes it VERY difficult to tell what is happening. Maybe about where it's happening, but that's about it if it's an "extreme" leak. Still worth having a mirror (thankfully, that's less of an issue with sidemount)

I do carry a XS Star Scuba Tool in my dive-pouch, however, hand-tightening could actually fix the problem I experienced underwater if I had been able to quickly determine what was happening, or simply tried to tighten it. Sadly, I only figured out exactly what the problem was later on the boat when I discovered my 2nd-stage had decided to go hang out with the sunglasses on the bottom of the lake.

2nd point on the solo dive sidemount setup : you are going in with plenty of single failure points, so this incident was just waiting to happend... You migth consider to have a double valve on at least one of your tank, this way you would be able to mitigate a 1st stage failure

IMO, this wasn't a "single failure point" because he was more than prepared for this incident. He could surface safely on either tank, if anything failed on either side.

Based on what I know about sidemount, this seems not-recommended. (I'm willing to accept I could be wrong about this). The extra valve would get in the way of how sidemount divers usually like to hook their tank bungies. Then there's what you do with that extra valve. Add another regulator? Now you have a bunch more hoses to get tangled up and complexity.

IMO, if one feels like they need more than 2 tanks for redundancy in sidemount, the right call is to add a 3rd, such as a pony/stage/full 3rd tank.

 

[Thrutch]

What's all that noise, how do y'all invent such convoluted rubbish is this called thinking aloud for no result

Great job you don't know your gear jumped into the water anyway, with busted stuff, you deserve a medal


Was it Colonel Mustard in the workshop with the spanner or Miss Scarlett by Lake Tahoe with the lead pipe

again polluting the Solo forum with non Solo dogma

Thanks, I do my best. I appreciate the helpful reply. Lol

 

[L13]

2nd point on the solo dive sidemount setup : you are going in with plenty of single failure points, so this incident was just waiting to happend... You migth consider to have a double valve on at least one of your tank, this way you would be able to mitigate a 1st stage failure

I would say the exact opposite! He had full redundancy so a single 1st stage failure was no big deal. This is the big advantage of sidemount (full redundancy, and in front of you for easy failure analysis). It was such a non-event he was calm enough to take a picture of himself during his deco.

 

[rob.mwpropane]

I'll throw myself out there.. I have rebuilt my regs and torqued to spec only to have that part inevitably come loose (same reg as op). I think in my 1st few years diving I would tighten the 1st stage tighter then needed and when trying to take it off would spin the reg and not the wheel, as someone said, little by little and then it would be loose.

Hose routing, messing with a reg, someone else messing with a reg.. really wouldn't be a bad idea to torque that piece once a year or something. Shyt happens. I'm really careful about being just "finger tight" now and nothing more.

@Thrutch how hard do you screw your regs on? Are they ever "hard" to take off? Ever still under a little pressure? Torque spec is 80 in lbs.

Kudos for not freaking out.. could happen to any of us. Might not be a bad idea to really dry that reg out since it was loose and depressurized under water... just a thought. Should be fine just being fresh water though.

 

[Thrutch]

how hard do you screw your regs on? Are they ever "hard" to take off? Ever still under a little pressure? Torque spec is 80 in lbs

Maybe too hard? That came up at my LDS, as well. It's not something I knew to be aware of until now. Always learning. I'd been using Deep 6 Scribbles without any issues for 3 years before upgrading to Signatures in June of this year.

Question on torque: the tech at my LDS ran off and torqued it to 15 ft/lbs (over 2x spec) before I could find the 80 in/lb number in the manual on my phone. He said that it was the standard for HOG regs and that the Deep 6 looked like a HOG. He and the other tech agreed that 80 in/lbs was not enough. My question: should I back it off to spec? Or has the damage been done (hopefully not)?

 

[rob.mwpropane]

Maybe too hard? That came up at my LDS, as well. It's not something I knew to be aware of until now. Always learning. I'd been using Deep 6 Scribbles without any issues for 3 years before upgrading to Signatures in June of this year.

Question on torque: the tech at my LDS ran off and torqued it to 15 ft/lbs (over 2x spec) before I could find the 80 in/lb number in the manual on my phone. He said that it was the standard for HOG regs and that the Deep 6 looked like a HOG. He and the other tech agreed that 80 in/lbs was not enough. My question: should I back it off to spec? Or has the damage been done (hopefully not)?

Honestly I'm not sure. That would be a question for @LandonL or @cerich. I would hope no damage was done. Personally I would probably back off, torque to spec and really keep an eye on it, at least for a while.

My one very small gripe with the 1st stages is that they seem a little harder to put on than other 1sts, and a bit harder to get off. I had to really make a conscious effort after I found I was loosening the wheel to being just slightly finger tight and nothing more.

That would chap me a little bit though.. the guys at your shop just torquing to what they thought and not looking it up... I mean it's easily available online. More than double is a bit excessive. Really makes taking a reg class worth it. I think there are more incompetent service techs than competent. (I wouldn't consider myself a competent service tech, but I at least know my regs and what happens to them is always on me).

 

[Thrutch]

Really makes taking a reg class worth it.

Yeah, that's at the top of my list now.

 

[John C. Ratliff]

I am amazed that there are people finger tightening their LP hoses! I’ve been diving over 60 years now, and have never had a LP (or HP for that matter) hose come loose. Why? Will, I use a wrench to tighten them down. I see no reason whatsoever to have the LP hoses only finger tight. Is that done so that they can be removed underwater? ‘Doesn’t seem reasonable to me at all.

Now, about the DIN connector; I don’t dive DIN regulators. But it seems that the wheel needs only to be hand tight when putting it onto a tank, as the seal is still an O-ring seal, right? But the wheel attachment to the regulator first stage needs to be tightened to specs. Am I missing something here?

SeaRat

 

[rob.mwpropane]

I am amazed that there are people finger tightening their LP hoses! I’ve been diving over 60 years now, and have never had a LP (or HP for that matter) hose come loose. Why? Will, I use a wrench to tighten them down. I see no reason whatsoever to have the LP hoses only finger tight. Is that done so that they can be removed underwater? ‘Doesn’t seem reasonable to me at all.

Now, about the DIN connector; I don’t dive DIN regulators. But it seems that the wheel needs only to be hand tight when putting it onto a tank, as the seal is still an O-ring seal, right? But the wheel attachment to the regulator first stage needs to be tightened to specs. Am I missing something here?

SeaRat

I don't think anywhere in this thread anyone was saying hoses only finger tight.. maybe I missed it? I was talking about the din wheel being finger tight.

Fwiw, I use wrenches too. Not crazy, just 1/8 snug or so. Enough it can't come loose. Same for plugs.