Rebreather - Cost of Ownership

[broncobowsher]

It also opens up locations. Helium is so rare in Truk and some live aboards that it is only offered for rebreathers.

As mentioned, pure economics, probably isn't there. But like your tax guy, the numbers can be bent to tell the story either way. It can make sense, even with the limited dives. Just depends on how someone wants to twist the numbers.

I can pack all the gas I need for a 3 day weekend into the back of a mid sized SUV and not overload it. If a dive location changes, I can still have the ideal gas for the new location. My 150' gas is the same as a 200'. That doesn't work as well on OC.

There are other less tangible factors that you can't really put a price on. You hear of people switching from doubles to a rebreather all the time, you don't hear about rebreather divers switching back to doubles.

 

[rddvet]

@tbone1004 what tank mounts are those orange colored mounts for the 3liter tanks? Most of the people I’ve seen doing this in cc are using those soft highland tank mounts but I’d prefer a hard mount. I was just thinking about trying a set of Kent tooling mounts that match what holds my primary bottles.

 

[grantctobin]

@tbone1004 what tank mounts are those orange colored mounts for the 3liter tanks? Most of the people I’ve seen doing this in cc are using those soft highland tank mounts but I’d prefer a hard mount. I was just thinking about trying a set of Kent tooling mounts that match what holds my primary bottles.

Kent Tooling does make a long mount that better supports these. I think it’s stock on the Fathom.

 

[rddvet]

Kent Tooling does make a long mount that better supports these. I think it’s stock on the Fathom.

I really like the Kent tooling brackets on my fathom and was thinking about attaching a second set for the smaller bottles if I set the unit up with Lola valves. I was just wondering what he was using for reference.

 

[Danseur]

It's about like asking how much a boat costs. Sure, you can figure on gas and slip fees, until you need to address something...

I have an "inexpensive" second hand RB that has had it's fair share of issues (now resolved?). All said, it is cheaper than new, but a hassle to get sorted. By going this route it was easier to get past the wife, but that's a whole other saga...

It really was about task loading. Wearing thick dry gloves, in current, 200-ish feet, juggling 2 or 3 AL80s plus backgas and a suit bottle, while swimming... Then looking at the thought of going further and adding more bottles. Once I did a few bottle rotation drills with more, I thumbed it and started towards a RB. Different tasks, but I felt that being vigilant about monitoring PPO2 was less "loaded" than managing an enormous bouquet of balloons.

And TIME to solve a problem at depth! That is worth any cost at all.

YMMV

 

[Ouvea]

Hello All:

Just wanted to thank everyone for their responses. I calculated my projected gas bill for a 24 dives per year at an average depth of 200ft for 25 minutes using 18/45 with 50 & 100% O2 to total around $3200.00. Helium cost about $2.00/cft in the SF Bay Area with only 2-3 shops supplying the gas. I'm certain that I can reduce my training expense by going to another training agency. However, at this junction, I'm just comfortable with GUE stuff and the Kool-Aid has been absorbed into the circulatory system already. Also the GUE crowd, at least in this area, is very active and organizes a lot tech boats. I won't have any issues finding buddies.

From what I've read, I'm going to economize on the gas by quite a bit but I also have a very expensive entrance ticket price. Using a CCR is going to reduce my Hellium expense and it will take several years for me to break even on the initial cost and the on-going recurring costs. However, I begin to see the futility of taking additional courses (Tech 2) on OC only to end up on a CCR just a few years down the road. I might as well have a solid understanding of the CCR and command of my platform underwater with the CCR before moving to more demanding dive profiles. Of course, saving on the He also is a bonus.

Thank you,
O.

 

[RainPilot]

As everyone has stated, a LOT of variables. My particular unit (Poseidon 6/7) All numbers are USD:

Cost of unit (good used one): 1500
Training to Tech 1 level: 1500

Dive costs:
18/45 dil fill, assuming only 1 dive per fill: 15
Scrubber: 20, but usually good for 2x Tech 1 dives so 10 per
Bailout : Same as a Tech 1 OC dive, but only one backgas tank. Also, if you dont use it you dont keep paying for it.

Periodic costs:
Sensors: 2x 70 per year, 140 total
Service every 2 years: 200 plus labour (about 200 if you dont do your own)

In my case, the dive ops charge per dive for "tank and weights" here, if I bring the CCR with my own gas they only charge me for the seat on the boat, so I save around 5 USD per dive which covers the scrubber, so I break even on a day of rec diving.

For tech 1 dives (50m light helium) I save around 50 per dive on gas, nett is 40 per dive after I factor in scrubber.
So, ignoring cells and service for the moment, it will take me 75 of those dives to recoup the cost of the unit and training.
Once you get to Tech 2 (Mod 2, Tec 60 CCR, Normoxic, whatever your agency calls it) then the savings start adding up even quicker.

If I was doing a hypoxic dive down to the U-boat here, 110m (360') then a fill of 10/70 in 2x 18L steels for backgas would set me back around 350 USD, each deep deco bottle would be another 50 (roughly) so lets say 500 in gas fills.
That means I would save around 400 per dive, meaning that 4 dives would pay for the unit (used) and 25 dives would buy a brand new unit.

 

[doctormike]

And TIME to solve a problem at depth! That is worth any cost at all.

This ^

 

[broncobowsher]

You can doctor the numbers a little more. Add a little baby booster and pump your own gasses. cuts the fill expense on the rebreather.

You put so much effort into calculating costs, but I didn't see the 'Enjoyment' adjustment being made. We dive for fun. A rebreather is more enjoyable during a dive. Nice and quiet, no gas switches.

 

[tbone1004]

I just used a generic price guess with shipping and taxes. Actual JJ Vandegraph cells currently range from about $100-$130 ea depending on where you get them. The DGX sensors are made by Analytical, not Vandegraph. Some folks prefer the "factory" sensors over "aftermarket", some folks dont care.

I haven't seen an appreciable difference between the two and at nearly half the cost, I'll stick with AI's...

@rddvet super pony tamers. One side will need the holes drilled on the other side to allow it to mount properly. They mount really tight to the 50's which I appreciated and weren't that expensive which was also nice. Soft straps would be fine for the 3l's though and probably less annoying to deal with.
Super Pony Tamer Pony Bottle Mount , Piranha Dive Shop |