Question Poll: Mandatory Sidemount Certification?

[p_kos]

#1 if you screw it up and breathe a cylinder dry, you'll have another one
#2 if your 1st or 2nd stage fails, you can feather the valve - hence no less gas than in BM
#3 the valves are actually easy to reach

BM is geat in narrow spaces though, and SM in flat spaces.

#1 not an issue in BM
#2 shut down post in BM, no need to occupy a hand or distract yourself with feathering, plus BM lets you carry more gas more easily period.
#3 I’ll give you that one but if you can’t reach your BM valves you shouldn’t dive BM

None of these make SM safer IMO.

 

[MichaelMc]

#1 not an issue in BM

How is breathing a cylinder (twin-set) dry not an issue with BM??

Understanding that running OOA is somewhat on the order of running out of gas in your car, as in not something you should do if you have any sense. But we do have drills for it and it seems not uncommon recreationally.

This is why my 'if I go OOA' was so funny. It would be really really hard to do with two separate tanks. It would take working at being dense. With one tank it only takes the lesser crime of being absent minded or inattentive, a much more common malady.

(Unless you are talking independent BM doubles, which is not the norm....)

 

[p_kos]

How is breathing a cylinder (twin-set) dry not an issue with BM??

Understanding that running OOA is somewhat on the order of running out of gas in your car, as in not something you should do if you have any sense. But we do have drills for it and it seems not uncommon recreationally.

This is why my 'if I go OOA' was so funny. It would be really really hard to do with two separate tanks. It would take working at being dense. With one tank it only takes the lesser crime of being absent minded or inattentive, a much more common malady.

(Unless you are talking independent BM doubles, which is not the norm....)

I mean breathing 1 tank dry is not an issue with BM unless you forget to open the isolator valve AND don’t bother to look at your SPG at all (you don’t have to remember to switch tanks/regs unless it’s independent doubles which is a whole other debate). And if you go through a set of doubles to the point they’re empty without noticing then you have problems beyond what any equipment configuration can solve.

 

[p_kos]

These days a reasonable ability to reach your valves is considered requisite.

Not just “these days”. Ability to reach and operate valves has always been a common sense “requisite” before diving them without a babysitter (cert card or not). Well, excluding the olden days when diving a set of doubles with a single double hose reg was the norm (you just had to reach the j-valve wire when the breathing got tough).

 

[Angelo Farina]

These days a reasonable ability to reach your valves is considered requisite.

What's the difference between reaching the valves of a 10+10 liters BM twin tank and of my 15-liters single?
Well, the twin tank has larger knobs, and they are closer to my head, so easier to reach and to operate.
Both tanks have double valves, double first stages and reserve...
Really, what's the difference?

 

[J-Vo]

What's the difference between reaching the valves of a 10+10 liters BM twin tank and of my 15-liters single?
Well, the twin tank has larger knobs, and they are closer to my head, so easier to reach and to operate.
Both tanks have double valves, double first stages and reserve...
Really, what's the difference?

Your making my argument for me. Side mount shouldn't require a certification any more than back mount, but the diver simply has to demonstrate to the instructor/operator that they have the skills to do the class/dive. A cert card does not necessarily guarantee the skillset, but it does let the instructor/operator off the legal hook.

That said, every time I have done technical dives with an unknown operator/guide/instructor, they have required a skills dive in a benign environment prior to doing any "real" dives. So, for the most part they don't trust the card anyway.

 

[mdwalter]

So there is “Tec Sidemount” which is usually issued in lieu of “Intro To Tec” if you are in a S/M configuration In both PADI and SDI/TDI. NOT SURE if NAUI does it that way too. But generally, an intro to Tec or above rating gets rental of BM doubles. Some places want an SM card to rent SM rigged tanks/gear, some don’t.

The points I am making - 1) if an operator requires a Sidemount cert for something- that’s their right - could be for liability or agency reasons. 2) intro to Tec is usually in a BM doubles config , but Tec Sidemount is -obviously-SM….so ….

If any operator ever exercises their "right" to require me to provide them a plastic card stating that someone else whom they may or may not know has certified me to use a particular gear configuration (sidemount, doubles, drysuit, DPV, etc.) I will exercise my right to choose a different operator. The one exception I will make is rebreather certification, as this is significantly different from other equipment-based certifications (though I am opposed to requiring a separate cert for every model of rebreather).
If any operator would like me to demonstrate my competence with whatever gear config I have chosen for that particular day or some particular piece of gear I've been using for 20 years but never obtained external written validation (a C card), I'm happy to do that. So far nobody has ever tried to stop me from diving whatever gear I had with me, including the times I showed up with a 1964 DA Aquamaster as my primary in 2018 (but never say never). I have had boat crews roll their eyes as I brought side mount tanks on board, but they seemed much happier after seeing me fully kit up on deck and be the first one into the water and down the line and then the last one up the ladder (still with tanks attached) and first one ready to pull away. But they never told me I couldn't dive SM or asked for any certs.