Does anyone know where in Texas near Austin I can get my old steel tanks hydro'ed with a plus rating if they pass? Please help...I'm not having much luck on my own!!!
Thanks Mucho, Trey :06:
Thanks Mucho, Trey :06:
PLUS HYDRO in Texas
- Thread starter tlessard
- Start date
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rkr3000
Guest
i would try a welding shop that sells cutting torches and supplies. they usually have hydro testing rooms. hope this helps. let me know how it turns out.
OP
I don't think I was very clear before...I know where to get a hydro done, but both dive shops I contacted and both hydro facilities I have been able to locate tell me they are not able to perform a plus rated hydro (10% over on LP tanks). One of them even told me I would have to return it to the manufacturer to get a new plus rating (I would love to see the faces of the people at US Divers if I did mail it back to them...it's 34 years old!!!). I have a nice old set of 72s that are in great shape and I'd hate to turn them into 66s that would sit mostly unused in my garage when I go diving with my AL80 buddies...I know the "can't plus after the initial 5 years" myth has been completely debunked on this website over and time again and I have now seen plus rated stamps on old tanks with my own eyes, so PLEASE HELP!!!
:help:
:help:
I had a steel 72 older than yours hydroed last spring... no plus rating for my tank alas. Our shop ships the tanks out somewhere in central Texas, maybe one of the same places you inquired after.
OP
Alrighty people...I talked with Gary at AAA Fire & Safety here in Austin, TX. He said if I could provide him with the DOT paperwork that shows it's leagal, he'd start doing Plus hydros right here in town!!! I'll be a hero to all of the LP steel divers in Austin! Woo Hoo! I'm gonna take him this document tomorrow: http://diverlink.com/downloads/gear/tankfills.pdf
Also, here is a link to all of the hydrostatic re-testers in the state of Texas: http://hazmat.dot.gov/files/approvals/hydro/cyl_tx.pdf
I'll let everyone know how it goes!!!
-Trey
Also, here is a link to all of the hydrostatic re-testers in the state of Texas: http://hazmat.dot.gov/files/approvals/hydro/cyl_tx.pdf
I'll let everyone know how it goes!!!
-Trey
Debraw
Contributor
I get the fact a tank CAN be filled to 10% plus if the fillable pressure but won't you still run into shops that won't fill past the original stamped pressure? Especially on particuarly old tanks?
OP
I think I would simply take my business elsewhere if I ran into that type of shop...if it happened where it was the only shop around, I'd just eat it and go about my slightly shorter dive! :scubadive
You can cite 49 CFR 173.302b (Special filling limits for DOT 3A, 3AX, 3AA, 3AAX, and 3T )
as shown below.
[Code of Federal Regulations]
[Title 49, Volume 2]
[Revised as of October 1, 2003]
From the U.S. Government Printing Office via GPO Access
[CITE: 49CFR173.302a]
[Page 560-562]
TITLE 49--TRANSPORTATION
CHAPTER I--RESEARCH AND SPECIAL PROGRAMS ADMINISTRATION, DEPARTMENT OF
TRANSPORTATION
PART 173_SHIPPERS_GENERAL REQUIREMENTS FOR SHIPMENTS AND PACKAGINGS--Table of Contents
Subpart G_Gases; Preparation and Packaging
Sec. 173.302a Additional requirements for shipment of nonliquefied
(permanent) compressed gases in specification cylinders.
(a) Detailed filling requirements. Nonliquefied compressed gases
(except gas in solution) for which filling requirements are not
specifically prescribed in Sec. 173.304a must be shipped subject to the
requirements in this section and Sec. Sec. 173.301, 173.301a, 173.302,
and 173.305 in specification cylinders, as follows:
(1) DOT 3, 3A, 3AA, 3AL, 3B, 3E, 4B, 4BA and 4BW cylinders.
(2) DOT 3HT cylinders. These cylinders are authorized for aircraft
use only and only for nonflammable gases. They have a maximum service
life of 24 years from the date of manufacture. The cylinders must be
equipped with frangible disc type pressure relief devices that meet the
requirements of Sec. 173.301(f). Each frangible disc must have a rated
bursting pressure not exceeding 90 percent of the minimum required test
pressure of the cylinder. Discs with fusible metal backing are not
permitted. Specification 3HT cylinders may be offered for transportation
only when packed in strong outer packagings conforming to the
requirements of Sec. 173.25.
(3) For a DOT 39 cylinder filled with a Division 2.1 material, the
internal volume of the cylinder may not exceed 1.23 L (75 in \3\).
(4) DOT 3AX, 3AAX, and 3T cylinders are authorized for Division 2.1
and 2.2 materials and for carbon monoxide.
[[Page 561]]
DOT 3T cylinders are not authorized for hydrogen. When used in methane
service, the methane must be a nonliquefied gas with a minimum purity of
98.0 percent methane and commercially free of corroding components.
(5) Aluminum cylinders manufactured in conformance with
specifications DOT 39 and 3AL are authorized for oxygen only under the
conditions specified in Sec. 173.302(b).
(b) Special filling limits for DOT 3A, 3AX, 3AA, 3AAX, and 3T
cylinders. A DOT 3A, 3AX, 3AA, 3AAX, and 3T cylinder may be filled with
a compressed gas, other than a liquefied, dissolved, Division 2.1, or
Division 2.3 gas, to a pressure 10 percent in excess of its marked
service pressure, provided:
(1) The cylinder is equipped with a frangible disc pressure relief
device (without fusible metal backing) having a bursting pressure not
exceeding the minimum prescribed test pressure.
(2) The cylinder's elastic expansion was determined at the time of
the last test or retest by the water jacket method.
(3) Either the average wall stress or the maximum wall stress does
not exceed the wall stress limitation shown in the following table:
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Average wall Maximum wall
Type of steel stress stress
limitation limitation
------------------------------------------------------------------------
I. Plain carbon steels over 0.35 carbon 53,000 58,000
and medium manganese steels............
II. Steels of analysis and heat 67,000 73,000
treatment specified in spec. 3AA.......
III. Steels of analysis and heat 87,000 94,000
treatment specified in spec. DOT-3T....
IV. Plain carbon steels less than 0.35 45,000 48,000
carbon made prior to 1920..............
------------------------------------------------------------------------
(i)(A) The average wall stress must be computed from the elastic
expansion data using the following formula:
S = 1.7EE / KV-0.4P
Where:
S = wall stress, pounds per square inch;
EE = elastic expansion (total less permanent) in cubic centimeters;
K = factor x 10-\7\ experimentally determined for the
particular type of cylinder being tested or derived in accordance with
CGA Pamphlet C-5;
V = internal volume in cubic centimeter (1 cubic inch = 16.387 cubic
centimeters);
P = test pressure, pounds per square inch.
(B) The formula in paragraph (b)(3)(i)(A) of this section is derived
from the formula in paragraph (b)(3)(ii) of this section and the
following:
EE = (PKVD2) / (D2-d2)
(ii) The maximum wall stress must be computed from the formula:
S = (P(1.3D2 + 0.4d2)) / (D2-
d2)
Where:
S = wall stress, pounds per square inch;
P = test pressure, pounds per square inch;
D = outside diameter, inches;
d = D-2t, where t=minimum wall thickness determined by a suitable
method.
(iii) Compliance with average wall stress limitation may be
determined by computing the elastic expansion rejection limit in
accordance with CGA Pamphlet C-5 (incorporated by reference; see Sec.
171.7 of this subchapter), by reference to data tabulated in CGA
Pamphlet C-5, or by the manufacturer's marked elastic expansion
rejection limit (REE) on the cylinder.
(4) An external and internal visual examination made at the time of
test or retest shows the cylinder to be free from excessive corrosion,
pitting, or dangerous defects.
(5) A plus sign (+) is added following the test date marking on the
cylinder to indicate compliance with paragraphs (b) (2), (b)(3), and
(b)(4) of this section. (c) Carbon monoxide. Carbon monoxide must be offered in a DOT 3, 3A,
3AX, 3AA, 3AAX, 3AL, 3E, or 3T cylinder having a minimum service
pressure of 1800 psig. The pressure in a steel cylinder may not exceed
1000 psig at 21 [deg]C (70 [deg]F), except that if the gas is dry and
sulfur free, the cylinder may be filled to 5/6 of the cylinder's service
pressure or 2000 psig, whichever is less. A DOT 3AL cylinder may be
filled to its marked service pressure. A DOT 3AL cylinder is authorized
only when transported by motor vehicle, rail car, or cargo-only
aircraft.
(d) Diborane and diborane mixtures. Diborane and diborane mixed with
[[Page 562]]
compatible compressed gas must be offered in a DOT 3AA1800 cylinder. The
maximum filling density of the diborane may not exceed 7 percent.
Diborane mixed with compatible compressed gas may not have a pressure
exceeding the service pressure of the cylinder if complete decomposition
of the diborane occurs. Cylinder valve assemblies must be protected in
accordance with Sec. 173.301(h).
[67 FR 51646, Aug. 8, 2002]
as shown below.
[Code of Federal Regulations]
[Title 49, Volume 2]
[Revised as of October 1, 2003]
From the U.S. Government Printing Office via GPO Access
[CITE: 49CFR173.302a]
[Page 560-562]
TITLE 49--TRANSPORTATION
CHAPTER I--RESEARCH AND SPECIAL PROGRAMS ADMINISTRATION, DEPARTMENT OF
TRANSPORTATION
PART 173_SHIPPERS_GENERAL REQUIREMENTS FOR SHIPMENTS AND PACKAGINGS--Table of Contents
Subpart G_Gases; Preparation and Packaging
Sec. 173.302a Additional requirements for shipment of nonliquefied
(permanent) compressed gases in specification cylinders.
(a) Detailed filling requirements. Nonliquefied compressed gases
(except gas in solution) for which filling requirements are not
specifically prescribed in Sec. 173.304a must be shipped subject to the
requirements in this section and Sec. Sec. 173.301, 173.301a, 173.302,
and 173.305 in specification cylinders, as follows:
(1) DOT 3, 3A, 3AA, 3AL, 3B, 3E, 4B, 4BA and 4BW cylinders.
(2) DOT 3HT cylinders. These cylinders are authorized for aircraft
use only and only for nonflammable gases. They have a maximum service
life of 24 years from the date of manufacture. The cylinders must be
equipped with frangible disc type pressure relief devices that meet the
requirements of Sec. 173.301(f). Each frangible disc must have a rated
bursting pressure not exceeding 90 percent of the minimum required test
pressure of the cylinder. Discs with fusible metal backing are not
permitted. Specification 3HT cylinders may be offered for transportation
only when packed in strong outer packagings conforming to the
requirements of Sec. 173.25.
(3) For a DOT 39 cylinder filled with a Division 2.1 material, the
internal volume of the cylinder may not exceed 1.23 L (75 in \3\).
(4) DOT 3AX, 3AAX, and 3T cylinders are authorized for Division 2.1
and 2.2 materials and for carbon monoxide.
[[Page 561]]
DOT 3T cylinders are not authorized for hydrogen. When used in methane
service, the methane must be a nonliquefied gas with a minimum purity of
98.0 percent methane and commercially free of corroding components.
(5) Aluminum cylinders manufactured in conformance with
specifications DOT 39 and 3AL are authorized for oxygen only under the
conditions specified in Sec. 173.302(b).
(b) Special filling limits for DOT 3A, 3AX, 3AA, 3AAX, and 3T
cylinders. A DOT 3A, 3AX, 3AA, 3AAX, and 3T cylinder may be filled with
a compressed gas, other than a liquefied, dissolved, Division 2.1, or
Division 2.3 gas, to a pressure 10 percent in excess of its marked
service pressure, provided:
(1) The cylinder is equipped with a frangible disc pressure relief
device (without fusible metal backing) having a bursting pressure not
exceeding the minimum prescribed test pressure.
(2) The cylinder's elastic expansion was determined at the time of
the last test or retest by the water jacket method.
(3) Either the average wall stress or the maximum wall stress does
not exceed the wall stress limitation shown in the following table:
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Average wall Maximum wall
Type of steel stress stress
limitation limitation
------------------------------------------------------------------------
I. Plain carbon steels over 0.35 carbon 53,000 58,000
and medium manganese steels............
II. Steels of analysis and heat 67,000 73,000
treatment specified in spec. 3AA.......
III. Steels of analysis and heat 87,000 94,000
treatment specified in spec. DOT-3T....
IV. Plain carbon steels less than 0.35 45,000 48,000
carbon made prior to 1920..............
------------------------------------------------------------------------
(i)(A) The average wall stress must be computed from the elastic
expansion data using the following formula:
S = 1.7EE / KV-0.4P
Where:
S = wall stress, pounds per square inch;
EE = elastic expansion (total less permanent) in cubic centimeters;
K = factor x 10-\7\ experimentally determined for the
particular type of cylinder being tested or derived in accordance with
CGA Pamphlet C-5;
V = internal volume in cubic centimeter (1 cubic inch = 16.387 cubic
centimeters);
P = test pressure, pounds per square inch.
(B) The formula in paragraph (b)(3)(i)(A) of this section is derived
from the formula in paragraph (b)(3)(ii) of this section and the
following:
EE = (PKVD2) / (D2-d2)
(ii) The maximum wall stress must be computed from the formula:
S = (P(1.3D2 + 0.4d2)) / (D2-
d2)
Where:
S = wall stress, pounds per square inch;
P = test pressure, pounds per square inch;
D = outside diameter, inches;
d = D-2t, where t=minimum wall thickness determined by a suitable
method.
(iii) Compliance with average wall stress limitation may be
determined by computing the elastic expansion rejection limit in
accordance with CGA Pamphlet C-5 (incorporated by reference; see Sec.
171.7 of this subchapter), by reference to data tabulated in CGA
Pamphlet C-5, or by the manufacturer's marked elastic expansion
rejection limit (REE) on the cylinder.
(4) An external and internal visual examination made at the time of
test or retest shows the cylinder to be free from excessive corrosion,
pitting, or dangerous defects.
(5) A plus sign (+) is added following the test date marking on the
cylinder to indicate compliance with paragraphs (b) (2), (b)(3), and
(b)(4) of this section. (c) Carbon monoxide. Carbon monoxide must be offered in a DOT 3, 3A,
3AX, 3AA, 3AAX, 3AL, 3E, or 3T cylinder having a minimum service
pressure of 1800 psig. The pressure in a steel cylinder may not exceed
1000 psig at 21 [deg]C (70 [deg]F), except that if the gas is dry and
sulfur free, the cylinder may be filled to 5/6 of the cylinder's service
pressure or 2000 psig, whichever is less. A DOT 3AL cylinder may be
filled to its marked service pressure. A DOT 3AL cylinder is authorized
only when transported by motor vehicle, rail car, or cargo-only
aircraft.
(d) Diborane and diborane mixtures. Diborane and diborane mixed with
[[Page 562]]
compatible compressed gas must be offered in a DOT 3AA1800 cylinder. The
maximum filling density of the diborane may not exceed 7 percent.
Diborane mixed with compatible compressed gas may not have a pressure
exceeding the service pressure of the cylinder if complete decomposition
of the diborane occurs. Cylinder valve assemblies must be protected in
accordance with Sec. 173.301(h).
[67 FR 51646, Aug. 8, 2002]
OP
Gary read over the DOT rules and has agreed to start stamping tanks with a plus rating immediately if they qualify in hydrostatic test!! They are located at the intersection of Airport Blvd and Guadalupe...very close to Highland Mall. I plan to send a flyer out to all of the Austin area dive shops advertising this so they can start sending their LP steel tanks over for a proper plus rated hydro!!!
AAA Fire & Safety - Ph# 512-451-4116
Gary is the tester and Bill works at the front desk. They only charge $12 for hydro if you take it directly to them...although I don't know yet if they plan on charging a higher rate for the plus testing (running the qualifying math formula). Either way it will be worth it!!!
-Trey :bang:
P.S. - Thanks for the CFR info cmay!
AAA Fire & Safety - Ph# 512-451-4116
Gary is the tester and Bill works at the front desk. They only charge $12 for hydro if you take it directly to them...although I don't know yet if they plan on charging a higher rate for the plus testing (running the qualifying math formula). Either way it will be worth it!!!
-Trey :bang:
P.S. - Thanks for the CFR info cmay!
SquintyPete
Contributor
tlessard - Thank you for the update! I will be droping my tank off in a few weeks with them.
That is alot better of a price than I expected.
That is alot better of a price than I expected.
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