Please Tell me That This is a Joke ?

[SparticleBrane]

Apparently they're faster. Because you know...scuba is a race.

 

[covediver]

Covediver, I think you are missing the point. The majority of the controversy surrounds a set of fins that cost nearly $800.

I guess my point is that it seems these fins have been controversial since their introduction. That may in part be due to the fact that even 20 years ago they were "high end" and employed an unorthodox (or unconventional if you prefer) design that got people to wondering why the fin might be worth the price. The $800 is only the latest manifestation of the controversy.

I can hardly wait until the DIR movement fuses with the FF movement, then things will really go to town...

 

[meesier42]

I 'still' would like to know what features and benefits are provided by these $800 fins.

Well, to say that their performance justifies their price, well... maybe, then again, maybe not.

I am hoping that most of you have at least read the Thruth of Dive Fins, granted we all expect this to be marketing propaganda, but... from diving them for 10+ years now, I'll testify that what they say is the truth and not just marketing. All of Bob's (Fin Doctor) designs harness the power of you thigh muscles and will encourage you to maintain proper swimming/streamlined position. This in turn means that you will have less cramping and lowered air consumption, as you are using larger muscles to push you along. Now I am sure that many of you will say larger muscles means more O2 to use them. Well, thats not true, as when kicking from your knees and calves you have a comparitively high load which produces significantly more lactic acid, which requries more O2 to metabolize. When kicking from the larger muscle groups you have a very low load on the muscle group, effectively preventing lactic acid production by maintaining aerobic conditions meaning your using O2 only to power the muscles, and since you quads are so strong, relative to your calves/hamstrings that your metabolic rate will also be significantly reduced.

Then, if you have read the Univeristy of Buffalo study of fins used for u/w swimming (you can find this on the Rubicon Library) they state a series of very interesting things. unforetunately they did not study FF, the most interesting thing was that all fins tested created drag not thrust on the recovery and that the human body is incapable of providing adequate muscle power on the recovery- meaning that a new design of fins would be beneficial, one that maximizes thrust on the power stroke, while minimizing the drag on the recovery stroke. Those of you that have expirience with the FF line, know this is exactly what they do.

Does all of this mean they would be worth the insane price, well... that is for you to decide. are they worth my money, yes.

To talk specifically about the Excellerator TanDelta, well I am just getting to know them and although my initial impression are excellent, I want to do much more extensive testing before I review them. I have been using the Extra TanDeltas for 10 years now and I can talk about them.

 

[Diver Dennis]

I would like to see the video...

 

[ERIC.K]

This is a great discussion, messier42, proper finning technique is certainly important I cannot say that I wouldn't be hooked on FF if I tried them, however the benefits you describe, using certain muscle groups as opposed to the calfs, never really been that big of an issue for me i'm not a big finner,I try to dive closer to the boat than most, after 500 or so dives my wife and I are more than pleased to let all the marathon divers kick 100 or so yards from the boat......I mean, I have seen folks put insane distances between themselves and the boat.....to see pretty much the same things we see just 25 to 30 feet from the boat, most instances we see more....so I would believe the race marathon divers would love these fins. I will however mention that force fins apparently have gotten the attention of the US Navy SEALS, I collect certain scuba items, and some of the SEAL diver models I have assembled come complete with force fins, I believe that the force fins can be worn over combat boots, so they are a favorite for combat divers. Kudos to Bob Evans for that!!!

 

[meesier42]

as for the Seals, many of them love FF, and your right they are excellent for those who need to travel distances. Maybe that is part of the reason I like them, as probably 75% or more of my diving has been shore diving and covering distances was very common for me. I have been known to swim in excess of 1/2 mile to get to the really good sites in Oahu. I definately found the Extra TanDeltas a huge advantage out there, even on the close in sites, I would still wear them as they have the ability to scull unlike any other fin I have used, which makes moving a large camera around really easy.

For the Seals, I have personnally seen many wearing the TanDelta fin and a couple wearing the Excellerating, Extras, and the Pros. Bob will tell you that the Smoke Black Tan Delta color was developed at the request of the Seals as was the SD-1 footpocket and the Military Fin that uses this adjustable type pocket.

All that said, it doesn't matter who does or does not use them, nor does the fact that many seals use them justify the price. only you can do that. I do think it is interesting that some of the top divers use them, but again that really doesn't matter in the end.

And I'll direct you to another string discussing the advantages of the line. http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/force-fin/215809-force-fins-my-experience-7.html

 

[ERIC.K]

Thank you for the discussion, I will certainly keep an open mind regarding force fins from now on....as always dive safe...Eric, P.S. I have done some research regarding the price and I have found them for 2 to 3 hundred dollars less than this thread would indicate.

 

[Bob Evans]

So to my previous question, what are the features and benefits of this fin that justify a 4x to 5x price difference with other fins?

Thank you for giving me the opportunity to espouse the virtues of my products, but it has already been said, as meesier42 directed in the Truth About Dive Fins, and elsewhere at forcefin.com

That being said, I am happy to answer any questions you might have thereafter to help you pull the sword out of the stone, but if you aren't willing, you can always plow the fields(tm).

 

[rickthescot]

You guys kill me. If you don't want $800 fins then don't buy them. I wear an Omega Sea master watch. It cost me a lot more than a Timex. It is not as accurate as a quartz watch. So friggin what! I like it, I can afford it and I wanted it. I think its a great thing to see a guy in this country put together a company that competes with the big guys who have more marketing dollars and manufacture off shore. He thinks he builds a better product and he put his money where his mouth is. Do you think Jet fins could be sold cheaper? Hell yes they could. How old are the molds being used by Scubapro. If you think FF is ripping you off I be you would be shocked to see the real profit made on his fins vs. any other fin maker. Respect his efforts.

 

[ZenDiver.3D]

But they're so pretty..... I mean, they pimped the fins. Isn't that MTV look worth $$600 or so extra? Think of the girls man! They would really dig you.....

Dee

"The more people I meet, the more I like my dog."