PADI tables finally going away?
- Thread starter jgros79
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I think that page 56 tells you differently ...
"Delayed Volation #2"
....
"you must ascend to just deeper than, and stay as close as possable to 60 feet (18 meters) .... When the Required Stop Depth indicates 50 ft/15m, etc, You can ascend to those depths and continue decompressing."
The "Immediate Violation Mode and Gage Mode" that you refer to ... "is preceded by Delayed Violation Mode 2"
... which brings up the post below and my questions on just how deep and how bad do you blow the NDL's to get a deco stop depth of over 60+ feet
Tigerman
Contributor
My computers manual specifically states that the computer will NOT reset if I remove the battery even for an extended period of time. Something Ive actually tried when I had to replace the battery and the manual is actually right. Guess its got a built-in backup battery that I wont try to access..Yep...some computers have a 'master reset' switch...and you can always remove-replace the batteries
Blackwood
Contributor
All tables give you deco times (i.e. depth/max ascent rate + SIT), but not all give deco times for non-'no stop' profiles.
Every dive has one primary limit (gas) and a couple of secondary limits (cold, hunger, boredom, etc.). I don't include time or depth because they are both functions of the primary limit.
My guess is that the most common way that recreational divers "go into deco" is by having a computer that resets itself to 21%, when they are diving Nitrox. At least, I know several people who have bent their computers because of that error. What's really annoying is that, unless you follow the computer's output and do all the (actually unnecessary) stops, you're locked out from using that computer for 48 hours, making the thing an expensive wrist ornament.
I love the Liquivision. If you don't do what it wants, it blinks at you, shrugs its shoulders, and goes to work on the next dive. So the fact that I forget to gas switch the computer when I gas switch me doesn't make the device any less useful.
I love the Liquivision. If you don't do what it wants, it blinks at you, shrugs its shoulders, and goes to work on the next dive. So the fact that I forget to gas switch the computer when I gas switch me doesn't make the device any less useful.
Semantics. I am not impressed with word games. We all know what Deco means: you have passed your NDL.
Yeah, I disagree. If I am on a commercial boat, they might want me up in an hour regardless of how far I am away from deco or how much gas I have. I often give my AOW students a floor and see if I can entice them deeper. Three limits work for me, but feel free to use what works for you! As for personal limits, those are important too. Training, skills, etc are all important in ascertaining if a particular dive is for you or not.
However, if you just planned your dive using one of the rec tables, you have probably chosen one depth's NDL and one 10 feet lower. Your depth limit is very important.
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I have an older computer, it does not allow me to plan dives.
Yesterday, the wife and I were going to a quarry. We stopped for an early brunch, planned out our day(when we'd dive, how deep, how long, how much surface time) so that we could do the dives we wanted to do, and be out of there when we wanted to leave.
We dove our plan, our computers happily chugging along telling us where we were with regard to time and depth.
We left right on time, having spent a happy day doing the dives we wanted to do.
Something that would have been impossible to do if we never learned tables and were only trained on how to look at the depth/time/deco limits of our particular computers. Our cards came with our OW course many years ago, and instead of spending several hundred dollars each on new computers whenever the next newest model came out, we've collected more tanks, lights, and so on.
Yesterday, the wife and I were going to a quarry. We stopped for an early brunch, planned out our day(when we'd dive, how deep, how long, how much surface time) so that we could do the dives we wanted to do, and be out of there when we wanted to leave.
We dove our plan, our computers happily chugging along telling us where we were with regard to time and depth.
We left right on time, having spent a happy day doing the dives we wanted to do.
Something that would have been impossible to do if we never learned tables and were only trained on how to look at the depth/time/deco limits of our particular computers. Our cards came with our OW course many years ago, and instead of spending several hundred dollars each on new computers whenever the next newest model came out, we've collected more tanks, lights, and so on.
Blackwood
Contributor
Naw. Deco means you have 'compressed' and are ascending or have ascended. Anything otherwise (i.e. passed your NDL) is the word game.
Limitations such as "be back in an hour" may exist, but they are artificial and not imposed by the dive.
Giving your students a floor is likely a representation of MOD, which flows down from gas.
Personal limits (such as experience/training) I completely agree with, so much so that I consider it to be implied.
I am curious about how the lockout works with different computers. Here's how it works with mine.
I have a 10 year old Suunto. When I violate NDL's it gives me a deco profile. If I leave the water without following that profile, it goes into gauge mode for 48 hours.
The worst I ever violated it was several years ago on a planned dive to a maximum depth of 180 feet into the hold of the San Francisco Maru in Chuuk. I had a total bottom time of 15 minutes. I had prior knowledge of what a good decompression profile would look like, but I followed the profile the computer gave me. It guided me through an ascent profile that was consistent with what I expected. When I was done, I got on the boat with no problems and with a computer that was ready for the next dive.
If I had not followed its profile and left the water too quickly, it would have locked out its functions and gone into the gauge mode. But it would not have happened until then.
In other words, it would not have abandoned me because I violated NDLs and gone into gauge mode during the dive; it would have gone into gauge mode after I abandoned its remedy for my NDL violation.
Perhaps yours works differently.
I have a 10 year old Suunto. When I violate NDL's it gives me a deco profile. If I leave the water without following that profile, it goes into gauge mode for 48 hours.
The worst I ever violated it was several years ago on a planned dive to a maximum depth of 180 feet into the hold of the San Francisco Maru in Chuuk. I had a total bottom time of 15 minutes. I had prior knowledge of what a good decompression profile would look like, but I followed the profile the computer gave me. It guided me through an ascent profile that was consistent with what I expected. When I was done, I got on the boat with no problems and with a computer that was ready for the next dive.
If I had not followed its profile and left the water too quickly, it would have locked out its functions and gone into the gauge mode. But it would not have happened until then.
In other words, it would not have abandoned me because I violated NDLs and gone into gauge mode during the dive; it would have gone into gauge mode after I abandoned its remedy for my NDL violation.
Perhaps yours works differently.
Spoken like a purist. I am a pragmatist. %99 of the Diving world uses deco to mean "passed the NDL". I'm gonna go with that. But I guess the best way to win an internet argument is to redefine a word to agree with your outlook.
When you surface in 90 minutes and the Coast Guard is on site looking for your butt, it may not seem so artificial.
Besides, limiting your time on the first dive helps extend your dive on the second. I stick by time, depth and gas as being the three big limits you discuss before you splash. Communicating these limits with your buddy is paramount if you are going to be able to complete the dive together. Take Conch Wall down in Key Largo. We can go shallow or deep depending on what we want to see/accomplish. If you go deep while I stay shallow, then there will be a lot of disparity in your following NDLs.
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