PADI tables finally going away?

[notivago]

@Quero
I am not kidding, I provided the SM so that people could access the monetary difference, you know as well as I do that such hardware ends up here really overpriced, smuggling notwithstanding, for "equivalent paying professions" say an programer that earn 60K monetary units per year it is much more "salty" to pay around 1300 monetary units than 200 that is what people that advocate for no tables do.

I work as a software developer and my wife is university teacher, we are not for our country standard under-payed an we are well within the strata that would sample the medium diver as you can imagine, yet I alone have the computer because I am a gear freak, she does not, as our third buddy that is an high earning bank manager does not have one. Both have only the fins, mask and snorkel.

So although the computer find it's way eventually to the divers around here, some people will only get them late. As for rental, as I stated earlier, I really don't know. One thing I am sure, it does not come as the default rented gear when you say you have nothing, so at least is supposed you don't need/want or they are not available. Never asked form them specifically.

As for me not knowing well my part, that is true, I am but a beginner and I have much, much to learn.

 

[Quero]

@Quero
I am not kidding, I provided the SM so that people could access the monetary difference, you know as well as I do that such hardware ends up here really overpriced, smuggling notwithstanding, for "equivalent paying professions" say an programer that earn 60K monetary units per year it is much more "salty" to pay around 1300 monetary units than 200 that is what people that advocate for no tables do.

I work as a software developer and my wife is university teacher, we are not for our country standard under-payed an we are well within the strata that would sample the medium diver as you can imagine, yet I alone have the computer because I am a gear freak, she does not, as our third buddy that is an high earning bank manager does not have one. Both have only the fins, mask and snorkel.

So although the computer find it's way eventually to the divers around here, some people will only get them late. As for rental, as I stated earlier, I really don't know. One thing I am sure, it does not come as the default rented gear when you say you have nothing, so at least is supposed you don't need/want or they are not available. Never asked form them specifically.

As for me not knowing well my part, that is true, I am but a beginner and I have much, much to learn.

Quite honestly, notivago, I find EVERYTHING in Brasil beyond rice and beans exhoribtantly expensive. It's very hard to afford going home. I don't even bother taking dive gear with me anymore when I return to Brasil. So it's not just the dive computers. They are no more expensive, proportionate to the cost of other diving services, than they are where I live and work--perhaps even less so given that diving here is quite cheap.

If dive computers are not offered as part of the rental package where you dive, that is something that divers who don't own them should press operators to include. These days, when students ask me what their first gear purchase should be (assuming they already have mask and fins), I almost always say "dive computer" since it's very portable, rental computers are harder to become familiar with than rental BCDs and regs, and the dive log becomes a critical piece of documentation in the case of a mishap while diving. I now include dive computers in the gear rental package of all of my students, and I make dive computers available to all of my visiting divers. Just yesterday I had divers renting full gear, including dive computers. If I can find affordable dive computers to include in my gear rental package here in Thailand, a country where the per capita GNI is only two-thirds that of Brasil, the operators there can do the same.

I usually find that people who are hesitant to invest in a dive computer don't really see themselves doing a whole lot of diving in the future and believe they will enjoy spending the money in some other way. It's not most often a case of simply not having the disposable income, but rather deciding that spending it on a dive computer will give them less pleasure than, say, spending it on a romantic weekend away at Campos do Jordão (R$ 940 for Friday/Saturday night stay). These divers will go along with others in their group on a diving daytrip or dive as one activity among others they might do while on holiday, but they don't typically plan their holidays around diving, as those of us who buy all our gear soon after certification do.

I would encourage you to look into renting dive computers for your wife and dive buddy on your next dive holiday if they really cannot buy them, even if they do know how to read tables.

 

[TMHeimer]

do.

I would encourage you to look into renting dive computers for your wife and dive buddy on your next dive holiday if they really cannot buy them, even if they do know how to read tables.

Man this post has gone on forever. Do you think decifering a dive computer manual is easier than learning the tables? Crap, the work is equally hard. So, rent one, read the manual at length and dive..who's gunna do that??? IF YOU DON'T OWN A COMPUTER USE THE TABLES for your own dives, and rent one and FAKE IT (I didn't say that) on the charters. Of course check out what sites/depths you're going to, to determine what you need to know. Before I owned a computer a DM placed one on my wrist and looked at it on deck. Wow, that made sense. I did the 70 foot dive with my watch and depth gauge and wondered what that thing was on my wrist. He never looked at it again. Crap.....
There is still some stuff I don't know about my computer. But it serves me well in my diving. As do the tables, and Nitrox tables (and I know how to program my computer for Nitrox but haven't done it yet, and did the Deep Diver course on Nitrox 28 with tables)--though I have yet to really use the ERDPml for any practical purposes. It all has to do with what type of diving your doing. Knowing tables can't hurt. Knowing computers can help. But RENT A COMPUTER AND USE IT?--like THAT DAY? I can't do that.

 

[Quero]

Do you think decifering a dive computer manual is easier than learning the tables?

Yes, I do, for the essential functions on a basic rental computer.

RENT A COMPUTER AND USE IT?--like THAT DAY? I can't do that.

Really? I always include a cheat sheet with my rental computers. Nobody has failed to figure the computer out or taken longer than 5-10 minutes to understand the display.

 

[Paladin]

I have a computer now. Bought it last fall. I still prefer the tables and if I use the computer, I just keep it in gauge mode as a depth gauge and bottom timer. Still wear my dive watch and analog depth gauge, though.

 

[Quero]

We had a dive guide die here a few years ago who did exactly what you do, Paladin. He left his dive computer in gauge mode and relied only on table calculations. Problem was that he made a mistake one day in his table calcs and had a dive accident he did not recover from. Maybe he was just not intelligent enough to use tables correctly, but more likely he just made a simple mistake and got on the wrong line somehow.

 

[caseybird]

Why is a dive table, calculated on a computer, then printed on a laminated plastic card better than a dive table calculated on a computer then displayed on a LED?

 

[AfterDark]

We had a dive guide die here a few years ago who did exactly what you do, Paladin. He left his dive computer in gauge mode and relied only on table calculations. Problem was that he made a mistake one day in his table calcs and had a dive accident he did not recover from. Maybe he was just not intelligent enough to use tables correctly, but more likely he just made a simple mistake and got on the wrong line somehow.

So I guess you think a computer can't f*** things? That's my field testing computer componets. They can malfunction like any other piece of hardware. I'd rather be responsible for my well being than be a victim of a malfunctioning computer. After 40 years of diving my brain is proven and time tested. I have a computer for people that run dive ops. It makes them feel better, and gets me in the water.

 

[Quero]

So I guess you think a computer can't f*** things? That's my field testing computer componets. They can malfunction like any other piece of hardware. I'd rather be responsible for my well being than be a victim of a malfunctioning computer. After 40 years of diving my brain is proven and time tested. I have a computer for people that run dive ops. It makes them feel better, and gets me in the water.

Now, don't go putting words in my mouth! I didn't say that computers are absolutely infallible. It is my observation, though, that humans are more prone to making mistakes in calculations than computers are.

 

[Emparo821]

i'm sure this has already been said multiple times but BOTH should be taught. it is true from here on out computers will be the defacto. but if you travel and go to some of the places that are less developed but have better diving then computers or computer repair may not be available. i think that groups like PADI and NAUI need to make their training a bit more stringent and make sure that students know the principles behind BOTH mediums. that way the student can adapt to any environment that they run into.