PADI Master Diver Certification

[loosebits]

Yep, I know that, you know that. A prospective diver doesn't know that.

 

[stardust]

I don't beleive anyone is talking about a military style approach to teaching OW diving, I haven't seen a single post saying "They should have to go through a SEAL course before they get their OW card"

SEALs yummy

Well, I hope I've never given the novice diver the impression that I'm too advanced to bother with helping them. When I've taken the new diver out to the lake with my usual buddy, I let them know that I will be happy to do some shallower dives with them but I was also planning on doing some deeper dives that they should sit out.

Anyway, I don't think anyone here is advocating a boot camp style for an OW class. I am simply advocating a higher set of standards. I don't want to keep prospective divers from signing up because the classes are too long or too expensive but if that's what it takes to let people survive a dive not by the grace of god but by the quality of their training then I wish that was a sacrifice the industry would be prepared to make.

Of course, the industry's number one goal is not training divers but making money. There is nothing we can do about that and you can't fault them for it. What we can do is try and raise the awareness level of the prospective diver so that they understand what they get out of an accelerated class versus the standard class versus somthing like a university class so they can make an informed decision as to which path is best for them.

Since 99% of the time, the prospective diver knows absolutly nothing about what to expect from an OW class, the only thing they have to go on is price and a PADI 5 Star Facility sticker on their window.

By the way, my mother was OW certified by a PADI 5 Star facility and the level of skill they threw her in the water with was almost crimnal (and perhaps would have been if things turned out differently). I hate to think what a shop without that rating would do.

I completely agree with you that OW should only be the begining of a diver's education, both formal, self-training and training by a mentor but I've seen that license-to-learn phrase thrown around by professionals as a justification for sending divers in the water without having the basic skills. I wonder when that phrase was first coined? I'm willing to bet its around the same time that OW classes stopped creating OW divers.

I think in principle we agree; Id like to see people better trained and definitely more aware than many are. I just want it to be accessible to as many as possible that want to do it and can; I don't like to see people trying to be elitist about it, not that you were. That's great that you dive with the new people too, I don't know where I first heard the phrase, but it made sense to me. I never went out without experienced people around for a long time after I got my OW.

 

[loosebits]

SEALs yummy
I think in principle we agree; Id like to see people better trained and definitely more aware than many are. I just want it to be accessible to as many as possible that want to do it and can; I don't like to see people trying to be elitist about it, not that you were. That's great that you dive with the new people too, I don't know where I first heard the phrase, but it made sense to me. I never went out without experienced people around for a long time after I got my OW.

You know, mentorship is great but there's nothing like diving with people that are at your own level. For me, it helps build confidence. I remember my first trip back to cave country since getting my intro card. I dove in a high-flow cave with a couple of full cave divers. While I greatly appreciated them changing their dive plan to accommodate me and everything I learned on the two dives I did with them (e.g., the best place to be in the Gallery at the Devil's System is not on the line but about 20' above it), one of my best cave dives was when I went diving with the just-certified intro divers that were on the trip. No instructors, no experienced cave divers, just us newbies. I know that I'm always 100% responsible for my own safety (even during a class) but when diving with someone far beyond my own level in an environment that is still new to me it is very hard not to think that 1) they will take care of me if I screw up and 2) man, I hope they don't see me screw up. Diving with others at your own level proves to you what they told you after your training: you're now prepared to dive in environments similar to which you were trained. Of course, if you aren't actually prepared, you may end up proving them wrong. Someone coined a nice phrase for that: Sudden High Intensity Training and while diving with inadequate skills you may find yourself in deep Sudden High Intensity Training.

 

[headhunter]

Dutchman's original questions were:

So what am I going to learn? What is involved in the Master Diver Certification?

These questions have been answered and the thread seems to have gone off topic to a discussion of "agency standards".

So, this thread has been closed to keep it from wandering any further from the original poster's inquiry.

Christian