Overpressurizing / Overfilling steel tanks

[joewr]

I believe there is a chair awaiting you at the bridge table. What conventions do you use? OD, could you rustle up a glass of Molson's finest for our friend? Rick, did you bring the chips and salsa?

I bid 4 hearts...always was prone to pre-emptive bids!

Joewr...

 

[svs3]

There are many who post to this board who are very closely connect to many different levels of the dive industry and maybe even the legal world. So a couple of questions:

1) Does anyone know personally or can provide links to media sources detailing the death or injury of one person involved in the overfilling to tanks? In this case I'm not real interested hearing that there are "some" or "many" incidents. I am asking for specific instances with independently verifiable(sp?) sources.

2) Can anyone provide any links or references to any civil or criminal verdicts that find fault and/or liability with any divers, techs, dive shops and/or tank manufacturers with regard to ANY issue related to the filling of scuba tanks? Maybe someone out there has access to Lexis/Nexis or West Law? Again, I am looking for specifics not second hand stories about what someone told you about what they overheard some stranger talking about on some charter a couple of years ago.

I don't for a second believe in some conspiracy of silence among dive dive shops and tank makers. So in my opinion if these things are happening and people are being hurt and killed then there are references somewhere.

The truth is out there,
Fox Mulder errr ... Sam

 

[joewr]

SVS3,

I have tried several approaches to get this information when the subject came up in another thread. A lawyer friend told me to try Undercurrents: they may have some info. I have not been able to find it.

My son, the atty, was going to do a search for me. His firm's offices were in the World Trade Center (he was not harmed) and, not surprisingly, his attention will be directed elsewhere for the foreseeable future.

However, he had begun the search and found some information that indicated out-of-court settlements. Since, the info was not conclusive, he was reluctant to cite it...even to dear old dad...because it is difficult to retract things once they are on the net!

It is, according to him, very common to have out-of-court settlements in issues such as this. That way the legal trail is obscured and precedent much harder to establish. This is not a conspiracy, just common legal practice...

Joewr

 

[svs3]

joewr,

Is there anything that can be determined from the pattern of these out of court settlements? Any idea how many settlements there are? Are they distributed in such a way as to suggest failures that are in line with statistical probability(sp?) of tank failures regardless of presure, treatment/maintance, ect of tanks. IOW, if x number of tanks are made then one can expect y number of failures all factors being equal.

I'm really just curious about what is "really" known about the subject for a public record point of view.

Though, given number tech divers overfilling their tanks (mainly LP tanks, I believe) if this were huge or common problem the paper trail would bigger.

Sam

P.S. Glad to hear your son survived 9/11 unscathed and I hope the others in his firm were as fortunate.

 

[100days-a-year]

I would like to agree with either side as both are right.I overfill on occasion.I have never heard here about any burst tanks.How about someone calling Birds Underwater,Dive outpost..etcThese are in the area where this stuff happens a lot.(not in their shops,but their region)Perhaps they will be able to give some info.The people I know in cave country do it routinely and have for more years than I've been diving.The caveat is whether or not you endanger someone else by it.Most of the guys I know would never let anyone know it,but as I'm there and see the guages or watch the fills while BSing.I am to the point now where that much gas just doesn't seem important.I just trim a coupla mins off the dive.But while I agree it's not a great idea,I also don't think the skys going to fall.You can pick each others points apart,but to deny the reality of it's widespread use or equally to deny it's inherent dangers would be less than informed to me.

 

[blacknet]

Hello,

I dive in the the 'cave country' region when I do the springs, on average I see about 5-6 tanks burst each year. Most of them are over filled and almost all of them are improperly stored/handled.

Ed

 

[Friggincold]

svs3,
You may wish to check www.psicylinders.com They are the people who train cylinder inspectors. They report about 10 cylinders worldwide explode each year for various reasons.As I recall most are alu not steel...Friggincold :cold:

 

[joewr]

What I wrote is all that I know and, as I said, I do not think I will learn more anytime soon.

If and when I do, I will let you know.

Joewr

 

[Iguana Don]

Shooting holes in blacknet's conspriacy theory.

Ed,

If you think that "Man Looses Both Legs in Scuba Shop Blast", won't make headlines, you need to think again. This kind of thing can't be covered up.

But the practice of over filling IMHO is limited mostly to the "technical community".

And again, when you get down to the water and your tank is not completely full, you gonna say, "It's not the fillers fault, it's a safety factor". Because if I fill your tank to 3000 psi at the shop or air station, I promise you, you won't have 3000psi when you hit the water.

And before anybody replies, we're talking REAL WORLD, not UTOPIA!

ID

 

[blacknet]

Hello,

Correction, the practice of overfilling is NOT limited to the tech community, as it's solely limited to the STUPID community. No real tech diver would ever consider overfilling a tank.

Ed