Oscilloscopes...

[The Chairman]

Point gap by the side of the road is 5 IBM cards or 2 matchbook covers.

You can't eye-ball that? I would then set the initial timing by putting the pulley on the timing mark and slowly reverse rotating the distributor until I heard that distinctive pop.

I’m building a kludge to watch IP dip using my Fluke scope while testing CE.

What's a kludge? I've been out of the industry for a very long time. Reflectometers were rare and expensive back then.

 

[TrimixToo]

You can't eye-ball that? I would then set the initial timing by putting the pulley on the timing mark and reverse rotating the distributor until I heard that distinctive pop.

What's a kludge? I've been out of the industry for a very long time. Reflectometers were rare and expensive back then.

Eyeballs: Good. Measurements: Better.

 

[Tracy]

Why not a continuity tone on a simple VO?

Continuity doesn't give you any information about wire integrity. If one strand of a battery cable is intact, it will show continuity. But it won't crank your engine over.
Volt dropping with a meter under load is the correct way to check wires. An incandescent test light would work on very small wires, but it won't give you any information about larger load carrying conductors.
What test lights normally do is cause corrosion in wires from people using them improperly and stabbing conductors. On newer vehicles, they tend to fry ECMs and PCMs by creating a high resistance short to ground. There really isn't anything that a test light is the correct tool for besides diagnosing other incandescent lights.

A lot of what I do is teach mechanics how to diagnose and troubleshoot wiring and CAN systems.

 

[Tracy]

Before that, it was diagnosing a points ignition system. Is there power to the coil? Do the points open and close?

That is another instance I still use a test light. So much easier to watch for a flash when checking points.

 

[Open Ocean Diver]

You can't eye-ball that? I would then set the initial timing by putting the pulley on the timing mark and slowly reverse rotating the distributor until I heard that distinctive pop.

What's a kludge? I've been out of the industry for a very long time. Reflectometers were rare and expensive back then.

“an ill-assorted collection of parts assembled to fulfill a particular purpose” lol

 

[The Chairman]

Eyeballs: Good. Measurements: Better.

The operative word was "side of the road". In my own car back then, a 1967 English Ford Cortina, with the Lucas Distributor, I kept a full ignition set, and a feeler gauge. However, I would reset it the next day with a dwell meter. Dwell beats a mechanical gap in lots of ways, including preserving point life.

On newer vehicles, they tend to fry ECMs and PCMs by creating a high resistance short to ground.

Hence the use of LEDs.

A lot of what I do is teach mechanics how to diagnose and troubleshoot wiring and CAN systems.

CAN Bus systems were in use, when I left the industry, but I had no need to diagnose them back then. That might have recently changed with this 2000 Dakota in my yard. I have a grandnephew who could use it, especially since I've redone the heads and timing chains.

“an ill-assorted collection of parts assembled to fulfill a particular purpose” lol

Yah, I looked that part up, but what about your kludge that will allow you to measure an IP dip. Hell, I'm not even sure what an IP dip is. Again, I never had to worry much more than certifying CAT5 wiring. Reflectometers were kind of cool back then, but if it didn't test out, we were replacing the wire anyway. Well, sockets first, and then the wire.

 

[Open Ocean Diver]

The operative word was "side of the road". In my own car back then, a 1967 English Ford Cortina, with the Lucas Distributor, I kept a full ignition set, and a feeler gauge. However, I would reset it the next day with a dwell meter. Dwell beats a mechanical gap in lots of ways, including preserving point life.

Hence the use of LEDs.

CAN Bus systems were in use, when I left the industry, but I had no need to diagnose them back then. That might have recently changed with this 2000 Dakota in my yard. I have a grandnephew who could use it, especially since I've redone the heads and timing chains.

Yah, I looked that part up, but what about your kludge that will allow you to measure an IP dip. Hell, I'm not even sure what an IP dip is. Again, I never had to worry much more than certifying CAT5 wiring. Reflectometers were kind of cool back then, but if it didn't test out, we were replacing the wire anyway. Well, sockets first, and then the wire.

When you’re testing single hose 2nd stage regulators cracking effort, IP will dip/drop indicates when the 2nd stage valve opens.

But I’m sure you know that.

 

[TrimixToo]

The operative word was "side of the road". In my own car back then, a 1967 English Ford Cortina, with the Lucas Distributor, I kept a full ignition set, and a feeler gauge. However, I would reset it the next day with a dwell meter. Dwell beats a mechanical gap in lots of ways, including preserving point life.

My point was that, even by the side of the road, it was easy to have a matchbook cover or IBM card at the time (both were pervasive back then), and knowing their thickness allowed measurement to something pretty close to spec.

I'd be fascinated to learn how setting the points using dwell can increase point life. I have _never_ seen the dwell vary much from the middle of the spec when the points were correctly gapped. There are of course, two aspects of point life, rubbing block wear and contact erosion. The correct condenser has a lot to do with the latter. A bit of the right kind of grease on the distributor cam has a lot to do with the former. But I'm always interested in learning something new.

The last thing we had with points and condenser was our 1976 Onan genset, used for house backup. I converted it to to electronic ignition 15+ years ago.

 

[rmssetc]

The last thing we had with points and condenser was our 1976 Onan genset, used for house backup. I converted it to to electronic ignition 15+ years ago.

[Veering further off-topic]
The last thing I had with points was a 1977 Kawasaki KZ1000. I converted it to a Dyna electronic ignition c. 1989. On the maiden long trip (NYC to Rochester, NY) the bike began to loose power. With a passenger & luggage, it was a struggle to keep up with traffic (75MPH?) uphill.

I pulled over to the side of the road and found there was no spark on 2 of the 4 cylinders. I had been riding a combination motorcycle and air compressor (2x 250cc cylinders). A passing motorist (also a rider) stopped to help, and he led us to a local motorcycle shop where I got a points set, then back to his house to swap the electronic ignition back to points and set the gap & timing. It's helpful when the good samaritan is an electrical engineer at the local nuclear plant! Got the motorcycle fixed and there were no more problems...until we surprised my future in-laws by arriving close to (after?) midnight, on a motorcycle.
[/Now resuming the slightly more on-topic conversation]

I've got a couple of Thermolution heated dive shirts with bad switches, and a Venture heated dive vest that let out the magic smoke as soon as I connected a battery. I suppose a 'scope would be helpful for troubleshooting them...guessing that they both do high/medium/low heat via PWM at a low enough frequency for a cheap (1MHz) scope to pick up.

 

[The Chairman]

I'd be fascinated to learn how setting the points using dwell can increase point life.

Mitchel manuals used to have these articles in their magazines designed to teach noobs and oldsters about new technology. I was always fascinated by them, reading more than my share. I do remember reading that condensers (capacitors) were sized to provide the proper spark duration. Too close or far, and it will cause pitting. Pitting and being non-parallel makes gapping points nigh on impossible. Since most were nickel plated, sanding or filing them to be smooth, ruined the finish. Using a dwell meter allowed you to set points precisely, regardless of any imperfections.