To coincide with the poll and questions regarding hand swimming and open water divers, let me ask divers should agency standards require that hand swimming and sculling result in open water instructor course failure?
Open Water Instructor Control: Hand Swimming/Sculling
- Thread starter Trace Malinowski
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fire_diver
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You mean an instructor candidate that is sculling? Yes, I think it should be grounds for failure.
I'd say no, but there should be a larger emphasis on the skillsets that would make obselete and/or unneccesary hand swimming/sculling in the first place. Most aren't taught alot of the other propulsion techniques like helo turning, frog/back kick.
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Must think about this.:daydreaming:
oh the cans of worms we open.... During my Padi IE I recall that the examiner had us on our knees per the typical Padi control scenerio, being forced to kneel in a close circle makes sculling a natural choice for small position movements. We can all tell the difference between hand sculling for small position changes vs. sculling to maintain an upright postion, or sculling as hand swimming, or even constant sculling in nervousness.
So if we were all failed for any sculling because of the control choice of the examiner that wouldn't be fair.
I recall in my wreck specialty being taught various kicks. Has anyone ever had swim lessons or swim club experience? The elementary backstroke kick is alot like frog kick, just face up.
So if we were all failed for any sculling because of the control choice of the examiner that wouldn't be fair.
I recall in my wreck specialty being taught various kicks. Has anyone ever had swim lessons or swim club experience? The elementary backstroke kick is alot like frog kick, just face up.
I am not going to get into the debate of whether students should be trained on a platform or at neutral buoyancy, but the reality for us is we train on a platform. I have found myself sculling a bit on the platform when stabilizing students who are a bit wobbly. No, I do not do it while actively swimming. Actually, since it was brought to my attention, I really try to watch myself & refrain from doing it at all. Should an instructor candidate be failed for doing it? I would say it depends on the circumstances. What are they doing right at that moment. If is constant & consistent, then maybe the candidate's overall diving style should be looked at & worked upon for improvement if need be or failure of the course if no improvement is made. I agree that we should be there to set the example, I would say failure or passing in that regards should be looked at whether the candidate has any desire to become that roll model they should be.
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Sheesh.
Students are great emmulators - and they're usually better learners than we give them credit for. So, plunk them in the water with a flail festival for an instructor, and they will learn that skill very well.
And this is an instructor candidate, for Pete's sake! Show some skillz that make you worthy.
All the best, James
Students are great emmulators - and they're usually better learners than we give them credit for. So, plunk them in the water with a flail festival for an instructor, and they will learn that skill very well.
And this is an instructor candidate, for Pete's sake! Show some skillz that make you worthy.
All the best, James
There's sculling and there's sculling. An occasional sweep of the hand certainly shouldn't be grounds for failure but if they can't maintain trim or swim in a straight line without their hands then there is a problem because these are skills that they are supposed to be able to transfer to their students.
As for your poll, I didn't vote. I hate "failing" students. To me failing should only ever be an option if the student chooses to give up after remedial instruction.
The only person who "fails" when they fail a student is the instructor. It's a "failure" to teach.
If you want to complete the poll then you should add a fourth option: "Teach them."
R..
fire_diver
Contributor
There are students who refuse to learn too. Not all classes can have unlimited time to work with each student either. Not all failure is because of the instructor. A class should have a specific time frame. If you can't perform up to par by the test date, then you fail. You have the chance to re-enroll as many times as you want / need.
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