Novice diver plunge for Backplate and Wing?

[tye1138]

If you go into a store and ask for a BPW setup, they're gonna freak out. A lot of shops hear that word "backplate" and it freaks them out. You don't need a backplate for anything as a recreational single tank diver. What you want is a harness and a wing, which is what most "technical" BC's are to begin with.

My first back inflate BC was the SCUBAPRO nighthawk, which worked well. I then went to a Zeagle ranger, which was also good. My last one was a OMS IQ pak, which was about the same as the others. I'd add the Dive Rite Transpack XT to that list as well, which is gonna be my next BC for sure. Those BC's are very good, they all do exactly what the recreational diver wants and shouldn't cost you an arm and a leg. You don't need a "backplate" you don't need a setup for doubles or anything like that. Just the simple single tank bands and you're good to go.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

An IQ pack or transpack is going to set him back more money and have stuff he does not need on it. If a shop freaks out over the backplate word the answer is easy. Walk out and buy from another shop. Perhaps one that sells on line. The great thing about a hog harness is you decide what you want on it. Not a mfg.

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[danvolker]

If you go into a store and ask for a BPW setup, they're gonna freak out. A lot of shops hear that word "backplate" and it freaks them out. You don't need a backplate for anything as a recreational single tank diver. What you want is a harness and a wing, which is what most "technical" BC's are to begin with.

My first back inflate BC was the SCUBAPRO nighthawk, which worked well. I then went to a Zeagle ranger, which was also good. My last one was a OMS IQ pak, which was about the same as the others. I'd add the Dive Rite Transpack XT to that list as well, which is gonna be my next BC for sure. Those BC's are very good, they all do exactly what the recreational diver wants and shouldn't cost you an arm and a leg. You don't need a "backplate" you don't need a setup for doubles or anything like that. Just the simple single tank bands and you're good to go.

I don't think a shop has "the right" to freak out about the interest of a diver in a backplate and wing....I would show the interested diver how much more solid the connection is between tank and diver body with a backplate system...you move, the tank moves...versus the typical bc system, where you move, the tank follows a moment later, and then shifts a bit... And while this is an arguement, it is not relevent, because the shop still has no business freaking out.

 

[Kitty_Kat]

From the comments that your LDS salesperson made, it sounds like your shop is much like mine. They want to sell you the "latest and greatest", which really isn't the BPW. Some bigger name brands (e.g. Scubapro) have started to realize that they have the opportunity to remarket this ingenious product towards more divers, but for the most part they remain overlooked in the recreational market. The BPW is such a simple system with very few bells and whistles and essentially no new technology --> hence why it works so well. Just like jet fins: very simple technology but amazingly effective. Many recreational shops do not want to sell this gear because it isn't cost effective for them... Like someone else mentioned, a decent BPW setup will last for 20+ years with essentially no maintenance, and most people that have one love them so much that they aren't going to want to buy a new BCD in 4 years. So why would a shop want to sell these? It takes money away from them. Technical shops don't have this problem because everything else that tech divers need (GAS and all that "stuff") earns them money

I started with two conventional BCDs (both used) that did my first 200+ dives with me, and they really were solid BCDs. Then a buddy stuck me in her BPW one day and now I will never return from the dark side . I really do have nothing against jacket style BCDS though.

I always find it funny how many people come up to me and comment on my "technical" gear. Many of the instructors and DM's I work with still make these comments even though over half of my shops instructional staff has this "technical" gear. And we are a purely recreational shop. At least in the case of the people I work with, after we have explained why we like this system so much and let them try it, they are converts.

All of our students use jacket style rental BCDs (Aqualung of some variety), and every weekend when I have to fit students for their gear I am reminded of how amazing an infinitely adjustable system really is. People are oddly shaped. Unfortunately this fact of life is not something that manufacturers can easily keep up with in a cost effective way. +1 for BPW.

I wouldn't be afraid to look at used gear if the cost of complete BPW systems is a turn off. Every piece of my BPW setup was bought used and pieced together (something which is a little more difficult as a new diver, not knowing exactly what you want). If you can find the larger pieces though (wing and backplace) used, the rest should be easy with a LDS's assistance. If you can, find a shop in your area that at least carries BPW gear and go talk to them, even if you don't buy it there!

 

[Mr Carcharodon]

If you go into a store and ask for a BPW setup, they're gonna freak out. A lot of shops hear that word "backplate" and it freaks them out.

If you go to shops where the entire staff freaks out, and has other mental disorders, shopping there probably is not a good idea.

You don't need a backplate for anything as a recreational single tank diver. What you want is a harness and a wing, which is what most "technical" BC's are to begin with.

Right. A backplate just provides stability, good trim and better weighting. Could you get those with a standard BC? Well maybe if you are lucky or buy several BCs. You're chances are better with a BP/W the first time out.

My first back inflate BC was the SCUBAPRO nighthawk, which worked well. I then went to a Zeagle ranger, which was also good. My last one was a OMS IQ pak, which was about the same as the others. I'd add the Dive Rite Transpack XT to that list as well, which is gonna be my next BC for sure.

So is sounds like you have never tried a BP/W. So the basis of your opinion is what exactly?

Those BC's are very good, they all do exactly what the recreational diver wants...

Well it is wonderful that you know what all recreational divers want, but odd that so many prefer a BP/W. Perhaps the original poster knows a little more about what he wants than you do.

 

[Dr. Lecter]

If you go into a store and ask for a BPW setup, they're gonna freak out. A lot of shops hear that word "backplate" and it freaks them out. You don't need a backplate for anything as a recreational single tank diver. What you want is a harness and a wing, which is what most "technical" BC's are to begin with.

I like to think this is a joke, but it's probably not. What he wants is a harness, a wing, and a way to tie those together with his tank/bands. He could use a relatively complicated fabric construct to do that, as you suggest. Or, he could put some ballast right where it needs to be while keeping the whole rig as compact and solid as possible by using a ing backplate. If he ever goes tech, he just buys a new wing

I spent many dives in a Zeagle Stiletto LTD, and it was a much better BC than the jacket POS in which I did my OW pool dives, but even it doesn't begin to compare to how a simple BP/W rig dives.

 

[Wolfie]

I didn't expect so many people respond to my question. Thank you all, folks! Your advice is based on your experience, real-life situations, so I should follow it very closely. You know what you're talking about.

I have an additional question.
One of my favorite sales guys from a local scuba store told me bp/w venue would cost me A LOT MORE than a "standard" BCD.

Can you confirm that statement of his? Reading this board, I was under impression it was possible to configure a decent bp/w rig for less than most BCD systems.
He insisted that a bp/w requires better quality regulators, octos, etc. I agree, if the bp/w is intended for technical, highly advanced diving, you should use high-end components. But for 'light' use?..

Run fast from the lds, bp/w may cost more if they only sell SP! My hog BPW harness was 299 compared to my Sherwood axis at $450. inflator is a standard quick release and no wing will care who made your regulator.

 

[Bob DBF]

inflator is a standard quick release and no wing will care who made your regulator.

I used my BP/W with a Nemrod Double hose reg, there was no inflater hose, and the wing didn't complain to me at all.


Your gear is your personal choice, I've seen excellent divers in all kinds if rigs and have concluded that its not the rig that makes them good. Look at your options, work on getting a test dive in different rigs and make your choice. If you decide to change gear later, you won't be the first diver to change his mind.




Bob
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“One thing is for sure you can't lie about your skills when you get in the water. The water tells everything!!! “ Mayor

I may be old, but I’m not dead yet.

 

[Lorenzoid]

I am leaning to the BP & W instead of a traditional jacket type BC. It's like a linux compared to a macbook. A bit difficult but rewarding in many respects. . . .

Great metaphor!

 

[tye1138]

If you go to shops where the entire staff freaks out, and has other mental disorders, shopping there probably is not a good idea.

You could be right, its been 10 years since I've paid much attention to what dive shops sell. But 10 years ago, BPW was the last thing on anyones shelf or radar. To this day, even here in Los Angeles, its amazing to find shops that still sell the same junk that was being sold 10 years ago.

Right. A backplate just provides stability, good trim and better weighting. Could you get those with a standard BC? Well maybe if you are lucky or buy several BCs. You're chances are better with a BP/W the first time out.

Your right, it does provide more stability for sure and its a lot simpler. The IQ pack for instance, had a backplate integrated into the BC. Ya get the pro's of a standard BC with the pro's of having a backplate. Many other brands offer the same concept, nice lightweight harness with padding and all the creature comforts plus the backplate.

So is sounds like you have never tried a BP/W. So the basis of your opinion is what exactly?

I've tried them and I settled on something that was more recreational based.

Well it is wonderful that you know what all recreational divers want, but odd that so many prefer a BP/W. Perhaps the original poster knows a little more about what he wants than you do.

I was merely giving the OP a different option and opinion, thats all. Its awesome to have so many people loving their BPW's, but there are other ways of doing it.