Nitrogen Narcosis - from breathing air?

[DocVikingo]

I seem to remember the purpose of monitoring heart beat is that the increased heart rate increases . . . . crap, what's the word? Caviitation? The churning action that causes "seeds" in the blood stream to begin to form bubbles? When the blood passes through various restrictions and such.

Hi Jax,

The word is cavitation.

Cavitation/tribonucleation is the process of formation of voids and clouds of bubbles in liquids under tension. Minuscule bubble clouds can be formed by turbulence in fluids like blood, including the turbulence caused by rapid or powerful movements of adjoining moving bodily surfaces such as joint, other skeletal and muscle surfaces.

Given a sufficient inert gas loading (e.g., nitrogen supersaturation), these seed bubbles may serve as receptacles for the diffusion of gasses passing from the dissolved to the free gas phase as the diver surfaces. If such micronuclei grow to bubbles of critical size and number, they can set the stage for DCI.

Regards,

DocVikingo

 

[Doppler]

I have driven home from dive sites late on a sunday evening breathing 50/50 heliox and/or 85/15 heliox (both decompression gases I employ pretty regularly). Totally subjective, but I'd say that my head is absolutely clearer... Now an interesting test might be to see how an 18/82 argox mixture feels.

Is there a PhD thesis here waiting to happen?

 

[pressure_zone]

Hi, I know this is an old thread, but I found it while searching the internet for information about whether nitrogen is narcotic at normal pressure. I subsequently found out that some research was done on this in 1975 and thought I would post it here. This is only one study and the results have not been repeated, so it could easily be a fluke and the conclusions could be wrong. Or maybe it's even some kind of hoax. But here is the study, from the Journal of Anesthesiology, 1975:, the full text is available for free:

The Anesthetic Effect of Air at Atmospheric Pressure | Anesthesiology | ASA Publications

The study looked specifically at reaction times when breathing helium rather than nitrogen. The abstract states: "There was a 9.3 per cent decrease in response time when subjects breathed helium-oxygen, a significant change. It is concluded that the nitrogen in ambient air slightly but measurably impairs human performance compared with a non-anesthetic gas such as helium."

And the conclusion states: "Both theories of anesthetic action and the evidence cited in this report suggest that the nitrogen concentration in atmospheric air causes a measurable performance decrement in man, that the "nitrogen blanket" effect suggested by Miles is a real phenomenon, and that human history has proceeded under partial narcosis. Perhaps this explains the current state of world affairs."

Obviously that is a joke at the end, so I don't know if that means the whole thing is a joke. I can't find any other indication that it's a joke.

 

[Chilly_Diver]

Thank u for your answers thus far! I'm still digesting all the responses....before I post more of my train of thought...just a note though that the kind of food we eat influences considerably the amount of resources our body needs to direct toward digestion (Notice that we get sleepy - when eating too much carbs/meat, etc...)...resources that could be applied to other body needs (Healing for example). As we use oxygen to burn food...so more digestion energy required -- higher breathing requirement (heavy breathing?) --> more nitrogen (and oxygen) over time?

Many fruits for example have a high water content (up to 90%) so quicker to digest and pass through our system.

Some interesting docs of relevance to above are:

The Beautiful Truth - talks about changing inputs (food) to get rid of / heal cancer or other chronic diseases-- even in late stages

Forks over Knives - a 2011 doc that has garnered considerable interest. Talks about reversing diabetes, heart disease, etc...by eliminating animal products.


Perhaps I will do some research on narcotic effects of oxygen...that is interesting!

One of the reasons I posted this is that I have done some -- water only fasting -- (Record is 65 hours so far, going for much longer in April). I have noticed differences in awareness of my spatial surroundings and perception and am curious how much of that change could be attributed to less breathing, and thus less nitrogen (and oxygen now) absorption over time.

This might also explain those in a higher meditative state having a different perception also (Studies have already shown brain function differences via MRI, etc..) - skilled practitioners are able to slow their breathing rate down considerably.

Are you also an anti-vacination advocate by chance?

 

[Duke Dive Medicine]

If the results of that study are true, one would think that the effects of nitrogen would be more linear, i.e. performance decrements would increase beginning just below the surface. I don't believe the literature supports this.

Best regards,
DDM

 

[scrane]

This thread seems to be progressing towards: "Not one... but two! You pay only a small shipping and handling charge to receive your second bottle of nitro-nix absolutely free!"

 

[Rred]

"We just don't notice our impairment"
A long time ago, when only scifi fans knew his name, Philip K. Dick pointed out that there's a natural blood fraction which is very similar to psilocybin (magic mushrooms) and that the difference between 'creative' people and the folks at your local DMV might just be how much psilocybin was in their blood.

Mammals, all mammals, seem to have the same craving for mind-altering substances. Jimson weed, peyote, fermented fruits, whatever.

 

[kaerius]

There's places on earth where you could get narced without being underwater. Remember that "the bends" predates scuba diving, miners were the first victims, so I find it likely that miners have been narced too.

 

[tursiops]

There's places on earth where you could get narced without being underwater. Remember that "the bends" predates scuba diving, miners were the first victims, so I find it likely that miners have been narced too.

I think you are confused: the "miners" you speak of were caisson workers, under pressure to keep the water out. They were experiencing an elevated partial pressure of N2, just as divers do. My ;point is that it is not necessary to be under water. It IS necessary to ahve a higher partial pressure of N2, and it doesn't matter how you get it.

 

[kaerius]

I think you are confused: the "miners" you speak of were caisson workers

The first documented case was a coal mine worker in 1841, beats the first documented caisson worker afflicted by 13 year, you are correct that they did use air pressure to keep the water out. I would assume it has occurred in history prior to that too, just not documented/understood.

Yes I'm quite aware that pressures greater than atmospheric pressure at sea level is required.