My AN/DP/Helitrox course

[stuartv]

You are indoctrinated to one way of diving that reduces legal exposure. You don't dare step out of that box.

Isn't the reduction of legal exposure accomplished by evaluating risk and taking steps to reduce risk of injury? I'm not sure why you would consider that to change the litmus of whether something is simply a personality clash versus, as you say, doing something stupid.

You said "she has done stupid things underwater." Are you asserting that doing something stupid underwater would or could be written off as a personality clash? That is what you seem to have said.

In my experience as a diver - not an instructor - if you do a stupid thing while out on a boat, the captain may frown at you or he may blow your hair back, depending on the captain and on how stupid it was. But, it's rare to be banned from a boat. But, if you go out on the same boat a lot and you do stupid things repeatedly, you really should expect to get banned. And that is not Stuart, the Instructor, saying that. That is Any Person With An Ounce Of Common Sense. Calling that "a personality clash" is nothing but rationalization intended to avoid taking personal responsibility for doing something stupid. That is saying "we had a personality clash" instead of saying "I did something stupid and got called out for it."

Note: *I* did not say she has done stupid stuff. You did.

 

[lowviz]

In my experience as a diver - not an instructor - if you do a stupid thing while out on a boat, the captain may frown at you or he may blow your hair back, depending on the captain and on how stupid it was. But, it's rare to be banned from a boat.

Please PM @Dive Right In Scuba to get their private input.

Then we can discuss intelligently...

 

[stuartv]

Please PM @Dive Right In Scuba to get their private input.

Then we can discuss intelligently...

I have. It does not sound like a simple "personality clash" to me. But, that is beside the point. YOU said she did stupid things underwater. How does that then translate as a clash of personalities?

If you are given a rule to follow (by someone in a position of authority - e.g. a boat captain or boat owner), you might consider the rule to be dumb. That could be a clash of personalities.

But, if you choose to break the rule just because you don't agree with it, that is no longer a clash of personalities.

 

[lowviz]

But, if you choose to break the rule just because you don't agree with it, that is no longer a clash of personalities.

You may need to go back to DRIS for this, but she gets emotional when her performance does not match her expectations. This gets immediately externalized. She can be verbally abusive. (I'll be getting an email on this one)

She is a good person at heart, but there is a whole lot of 'stuff' that can hide her better points when she is under duress. She can learn and remember but melts down rather easily.

Ready for tech? IMHO, she is getting there. Blew off a deep dive on a 'bucket-list' wreck as she was not comfortable. Progress.

 

[helodriver87]

She can learn and remember but melts down rather easily.

That worries me more than any lack of skill or ability. Skills can be fixed and improved with repetition. What a person does under stress or when frustrated is very closely linked to fundamental aspects of their personality. That can be changed, but to a lesser degree. And it's far, far harder.

 

[formernuke]

Please PM @Dive Right In Scuba to get their private input.

Then we can discuss intelligently...

I consider what happens between her and DRIS as none of my business.

I have had PM conversations with her and she was friendly, helpful and professional.

I have had conversations with DRIS with them phone helping me replace seals etc on my drysuit. Same friendly helpful, friendly and professional.

In other words unless one side or another does something directly to me or I actually witness something, I'm staying completely neutral in this.

 

[lowviz]

What a person does under stress or when frustrated is very closely linked to fundamental aspects of their personality. That can be changed, but to a lesser degree. And it's far, far harder.

Precisely. Most difficult. I have my demons too. But isn't that the whole central idea of "old school" dive instruction?

Do today's instructors just play to the profitable center of the bell curve...

I'm looking for a classic SB quote. Something like >under stress, one reverts to one's most basic training...<

Anybody?

 

[helodriver87]

Precisely. Most difficult. I have my demons too. But isn't that the whole central idea of "old school" dive instruction?

Do today's instructors just play to the profitable center of the bell curve...

I'm looking for a classic SB quote. Something like >under stress, one reverts to one's most basic training...<

Anybody?

I know the one. Can't remember exact wording, but the gist of it is that you don't rise to the occasion, you default to your level of preparation.

I teach new pilots for a living. Stress reactions are much deeper than other deficiencies. They're very difficult to change. And with a student that's resistant to criticism, it's effectively impossible. To the point that we typically just eliminate students from training who can't handle stress. In theory, anyone can make those changes with serious, concerted effort. In practice, there are just some personality types that are unsuited for certain activities.

 

[tmassey]

How about:

“We don't rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training.”

― Archilochus

I know for me, that was my biggest criticism in my Fundies class: that I moved too fast, on many levels. I would respond to something (a command, an issue, etc.) too quickly, and by using movements that were too fast. For someone who prides himself on mental agility, it was a weird and painful lession. Here I am a year later, and only after a real and deep focus on this can I see progress. Enough? Don't know -- doubt it. But no other SCUBA "skill" has been harder to work on. Because it's not something I *do*, it's something I *am*.

I see the same sort of thing in other divers, too -- including @Marie13. Something that they consider a strength in their normal life that interferes with their ability to perform beyond a certain level in the water. To overcome that requires *so* many things: awareness of the issue, understanding of why it's a negative in this context, self-awareness to understand why you're doing it and the self-control to see it in advance and stop it.

It's a struggle. Makes trim and buoyancy look like kindergarten stuff...

 

[lowviz]

^^^