More on Pony Bottles: TSA Running in Cirlcles - Long

[DandyDon]

I have checked my Pony in luggage for a dozen trips - to Calf, Roatan, Belize, Cozumel, Florida, North Carolina, Montreal - even though previous TSA regs prohibited it completely.

A Dive Training magazine article came out a few months ago, after the SpareAir manufactureres had lobbied TSA, publishing a lettter from TSA and explaining that tanks could be carried in checked luggage or carry-on. I really didn't follow the article fully, but at the time - these were the new, revised regs...

From: http://www.tsa.gov/public/interapp/editorial/editorial_1190.xml (I couldn't find a date, but this is the version I have seen for months)

"Dive tanks or any compressed gas cylinders are prohibited as checked baggage. A compressed gas cylinder is allowed in carry-on baggage only if the regulator valve is completely disconnected from the cylinder and the cylinder is no longer sealed (i.e. the cylinder has an open end). The cylinder must have an opening to allow for a visual inspection inside. TSA Security Screeners will NOT remove the seal/regulator valve from the cylinder at the checkpoint. If the cylinder is sealed (i.e. the regulator valve is still attached), the cylinder is prohibited and not permitted through the security checkpoint, regardless of the reading on the pressure gauge indicator. TSA Security Screeners must visibly ensure that the cylinder is completely empty and that there are no prohibited items inside."

I don't want to carry my Pony bottle on a plane. A lady was arrested and cuffed last week in Tampa for having a weighted bookmark - "that could be used ao knock people unconcious." Dallas News, Sept 18, 2004

Now I find this on the net...

From: http://www.tsa.gov/public/display?theme=8&content=09000519800b4e21 July 2, 2004:

"Sporting Goods – Scuba tanks are not allowed on commercial airlines for safety reasons. Ship scuba tanks or consider renting a tank at your destination."

I emailed this to the magazine's Associate Publisher, Jerryy Beaty - (580) 920-0039, FAX (580) 920-2151 jerry@jerrybeaty.com, then called him for a nice chat. He sent me a copy of a TSA email to the manufacturer:

www.tsa.gov
U.S. Department of Homeland Security
Arlington, VA 22202

Via E-Mail
Mr. Keith Thomas
keith@submersiblesystems.com

Dear Mr. Thomas:

The Transportation Security Administration’s Office of Civil Rights received your e-mail dated March 10, 2004. In that e-mail, you stated that some of your customers called you and stated their scuba diving spare air cylinders were confiscated by TSA employees. Specifically, you stated that you had information on empty scuba spare air cylinders, and that they are not on the list of prohibited items. On April 5, 2004, Ms. Mya Mya Myaing of my staff contacted you via e-mail, and you responded on April 9, 2004, providing more details of your issue of concern. Please accept our apologies for not having had systems in place so that we could have responded earlier.

In your e-mail message, you indicated you would like clarification on what happens to items that are confiscated. I trust the following information which is available on the website will be of use to you and your customers.

On February 17, 2002, the Transportation Security Administration (TSA) assumed responsibility for security at all commercial airports in the United States. TSA was mandated to conduct 100 percent screening of all checked baggage being transported by air. TSA met the December 31, 2002, deadline with the implementation of an enhanced baggage screening process. Enhanced security measures require that all checked baggage undergo some form of screening for prohibited items. If a passenger brings a prohibited item to the checkpoint, one may be criminally and/or civilly prosecuted or, at the least asked to rid of the item. A screener or law enforcement officer will make the determination, depending on what the item is and the circumstances. This is because bringing a prohibited item to a security checkpoint – even accidentally is illegal.

The prohibited item may be detained for use in an investigation and, if necessary as evidence in criminal and/or civil prosecution. If permitted by the screener or law enforcement officer, the passenger may be allowed to consult with the airlines for possible assistance in placing the prohibited item in checked baggage; or withdraw the item from the screening checkpoint at that time; or make other arrangements such as taking it to the car; or voluntarily abandon the item. Items that are voluntarily abandoned cannot be recovered and will not be returned to the passenger.

A scuba tank is a pressure vessel controlled by Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), which is a division of the Department of Transportation (DOT). Compressed air in a scuba tank is considered to be hazardous material and subject to transportation restrictions. But when the scuba tank is empty or below 41 PSI, it is inert and uncontrolled and can go with no restriction. In your e-mail feedback, you mentioned that you are now recommending your customers to remove the regulator (top) when traveling, so TSA screeners can see that the scuba tanks are empty. We are confident that as TSA becomes more experienced in communicating its operational and security policies to the traveling public, and as the public becomes more familiar with these policies, incidents of the kind you complained of will decrease. Further, the Office of Civil Rights continues to work with various offices within TSA to advise them of civil rights complaints, to examine policies that have a civil rights impact, and to propose changes where appropriate. In addition, the Office of Civil Rights facilitates targeted training to TSA employees to address civil rights concerns affecting the traveling public.

The circumstances you stated do not rise to a level constituting a complaint of program discrimination on any prohibited basis. Therefore, OCR does not have authority to redress your specific concerns. Accordingly, OCR will administratively close this inquiry. However, in order to be as responsive as possible to your concern, we are forwarding your letter to the Federal Security Directors at the Houston International Airport, Texas, and the John Wayne (SNA) Airport, Orange County. In forwarding this material, we have asked that the Federal Security Director review your correspondence and take whatever action may be appropriate.

Again, on behalf of TSA, please accept our apologies for any discomfort you may have experienced while traveling. Thank you for bringing this matter to our attention.

Sincerely,
Teresa A. Ferrante for
Tamara L. Miller
Director
Office of Civil Rights
cc: Federal Security Director, Houston International Airport
Federal Security Director, John Wayne International Airport

My Gawd - why couldn't TSA just say "Yes, it's okay; ignore our web site."

Here's a link to the site with the letter on TSA letterhead, albeit undated. I guess I'll print and carry a copy with the Pony bottle, valve still in bu fully drained. http://www.spareair.com/product/images_prod/tsa_letter_2004_nh.pdf

The mystery goes on... :wacko:

Courtesy Copy to: Jerry Beaty, with my apprecaition

 

[RICHinNC]

Hey Don,
Mucking up the bottom again are ya??? I really wonder if they will ever get a true handle on the situation. But, when I take mine again....or try (with someone standing by to take it home)...I will def take the valve out.

When I left for Germany (fly home tomorrow!!!!) I asked my local TSA and he got out a flip chart of hazardous items. It also had a couple of pages of NON hazardous items. Guess what????????? Dive tanks were on the non hazardous pages. Duh.

Take care and wish me luck on my flight.
rich

 

[DandyDon]

I did enjoy one TSA encounter:

I stood by quietly watching as the agent hand inspected my packed dive gear at Lubbock’s airport, and this time the agent actually acknowledged his discovery of my 19 cf bottle – surprisingly with the words: “Looks like a Pony bottle?” I know that some agents must also be divers, but so seldom have I had one actually communicate with me – at open luggage screening or security check points – that this was a pleasant change. I had a copy of the latest TSA memo authorizing empty tanks onto planes in a zip-lock inside the tank’s carrying bag and a second copy in my pocket, but he offered no objection or question to the tank, and we exchanged a few words about diving.

He then spotted a USMC pin on a cap packed in the same bag, and he pointed to a similar one on his shirt’s lapel. We exchanged a few pleasant words over that as well.

I probably have been unfair in my words about TSA agents in general, allowing my strong disdain for the administration itself and the politics that fuels it to unfairly overshadow my views and comments of the employees. I have experienced very few negative experiences with TSA agents themselves or the international security agents who are charged with working to TSA standards on flights to the US.

Then, I experienced an unsettling event on the plane back from Raleigh NC:

During the final boarding phase of the aircraft, a non-English speaking lady of possible African attire and descent started using a metal paring knife to peel an apple. The American lady seated next to the foreigner took quick departure to another part of the plane and a couple of airline employees came aboard to escort the lady and her belongings off he plane for rescreening. I thought it odd that a TSA agent did not board the plane, but she was rescreened and reboarded without her contraband. It had seemed that half of the TSA agents were socializing among themselves while the other half were slowly getting us thru the screening gates, but I’ll bet they had an interesting butt chewing over the kitchen cutlery incident.

And then I got home and unpacked my bags!

In the large duffle bag where I carry my Pony, I found a TSA notice of inspection; the Pony little carry with the TSA document authorizing it onto a plane inside, but zipped shut – proving to me that they had looked at the Pony, as I always leave the carrying bag unzipped; and missing from its packing – the bottle of combat boot “edge dressing” I’d bought at an off-base store near USMC Cherry Point. I guess maybe there was some alcohol content? Damn?!