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Manifold question - what does 200 bar vs. 300 bar mean?

Discussion in 'Cave Diving' started by brianstclair, Jan 13, 2006.

  1. brianstclair

    brianstclair Contributor

    # of Dives: 100 - 199
    Location: Ocala, FL
    185
    0
    I'm casually starting to look for the pieces of what will eventually become my full cave setup, and I have a question regarding manifolds. I usually see manifolds described as 200 bar or 300 bar. What does this mean? Does it have to do with the thread size, and therefor the tank neck sizes that it will fit on? Are there any pressure implications with having a 200 bar manifold, for example (and not that anyone would do this) filling twin LP 95s to 3500 PSI - is that a problem? How about price differences - is 300 bar typically more expensive than 200 bar?

    Thanks in advance.

    Brian
     
  2. Jay Roy

    Jay Roy Contributor

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Carlsbad Springs Ontario
    244
    1
    Basicly a 300 bar manifold has a deeper counterbore in which the regulator is threaded into. Therefor there are more threads creating more holding power. Something to keep in mind, a 300 bar reg will work with either a 300 bar or 200 bar manifold but a 200 bar reg (not sure if they make them) would not work with a 300 bar manifold because it would not screw in far enough to seat the o-ring. 300 bar manifolds cost a little bit more but probably worth it in the long run..
     
  3. brianstclair

    brianstclair Contributor

    # of Dives: 100 - 199
    Location: Ocala, FL
    185
    0
    So it's got to do with the "depth" of the DIN valves? I don't want to get into a DIN versus yoke debate, but with the yoke inserts screwed in and using yoke style regs, is there any practical difference?

    Brian
     
  4. PfcAJ

    PfcAJ Contributor

    # of Dives: 5,000 - ∞
    Location: St Petersburg, Fl
    8,009
    7,518
    Also, 200 bar manifolds can accept a screw in adapter that allows for use of a yolk reg.

    The only 200 bar regulator I've ever seen was an argon reg, possibly the one from Salvo (not sure).
     
  5. PfcAJ

    PfcAJ Contributor

    # of Dives: 5,000 - ∞
    Location: St Petersburg, Fl
    8,009
    7,518
    We posted at the same time, apparently.

    No, there isn't and real difference if the yolk adapter is in place. I'm sure some will see the extra o-ring as a possible failure point, but the yolk will work just like it was a "standard" k-valve.
     
  6. IceDiverInCA

    IceDiverInCA Contributor

    123
    0
  7. brianstclair

    brianstclair Contributor

    # of Dives: 100 - 199
    Location: Ocala, FL
    185
    0
    Perfect! Thanks everyone. Mission accomplished.

    Brian
     
  8. drbill

    drbill The Lorax for the Kelp Forest Scuba Legend

    # of Dives: 2,500 - 4,999
    Location: Santa Catalina Island, CA
    22,823
    6,027
    Interesting. I was always under the impression that bar was a non-imperial measure of pressure and therefore these ratings refer to max pressure. I was aware of the difference in depth of the different valves, but thoughht that just had to do with preventing a lower pressure rated reg from seating on a high pressure tank.
     
  9. addexdiver

    addexdiver Registered

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: Finger Lakes, NY
    10
    0
    The term "bar" is measure of pressure equal to 1 atmosphere or 14.7psi - in Europe they only talk bar - also in weather forecasts - have a look at the "barametric" pressure...always around 1000mbar = 1 bar.

    So for us divers, a 200 bar valve would be rated for 2,940 psi (not what you want for a good cave fill) or 4,410 psi for the 300 bar valves. I have no idea of exactly what all the mechanical differences are, but it certainly makes sense to me that since they both fit on the same tank, the thread should be the same except longer (to gain more strength) for the 300 bar design. I expect they might have different tank to valve o-ring groove designs but would be surprised if the DIN Valve to 1st stage reg threads and depths are different since that is a standard (probably rated to higher pressure than the tank to valve thread).
     
  10. Jason B

    Jason B Contributor

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: NC
    2,031
    2
    According to the Dive Rite link above....
    "keep in mind the '200 bar' term is meaningless so far as the pressure rating of the valve outlet itself is concerned, it is a DIN 477 #13 valve outlet and the outlet itself does not have a pressure rating."




    Again, I'll refer to the Dive Rite article linked above....
    "Is a 300 bar SCUBA valve outlet stronger than 200 bar? No, they are equally strong. Only the first few threads in both the 200 bar and 300 bar outlet designs are doing the work, the remaining threads on the 300 bar outlet are there simply to create a deliberate incompatibility with a 200 bar connector."
     

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