Low, mid, or high range regulator?

[Caveeagle]

I won't be owning my own tanks - probably looking at 50-60 dives/year, split between PNW cold and travel destinations (mostly Hawaii + Caribbean). The occassional big trip will take me to the South Pacific, or Africa, or something of the sort.

You might check with places you are likely to rent tanks. If they rent Steel 100's there is a good chance they will have DIN / Pro valves.

..(and is it really THAT big of a deal if I snag a Yoke with DIN adaptor vs a DIN with Yoke adaptor)?

You can't put a Yoke Reg on a dedicated DIN tank valve. So there is no DIN adapter. **The exception would be if you have a DIN/Yoke convertible "Pro" valve, where there is a threaded insert allowing you to put a yoke reg onto it.

And... using a Yoke adapter, allows you to use a DIN regulator on any Yoke tank. No, its not a big deal. Poseidon regs have been sold for years in a DIN+Yoke adapter configuration. (do an ebay search for 'Poseidon Regulator' and you will see several examples. The only downside (as Tbone stated) is placing the 1st stage ~1" closer to the back of your head. So if you have a melon like Bob's Big Boy, you might consider this a problem.

Recommendation on a good IP gauge I can order today? Plus a video tutorial on how to use?

I have this one, and it works great.

https://www.amazon.com/DGX-Deluxe-G...qid=1467057260&sr=8-1&keywords=scuba+IP+gauge

You just plug it into your LP inflator hose and watch how your IP cycles as you test breath the regulator. It should drop as you inhale, and pump back up to a consistent IP that matches your regs manufacturer spec. You are trying to make sure it does not continue to build pressure way up above that causing either a 2nd stage free-flow (**or a venting of the OPV in some regs).

The DR XT setup has 2x identical 2nd stages, 2x identical 1st stages, and 2x air pressure gauges eh? Ok Tbone, how about this: what are the DOWNSIDES to this kit or selection?

Not really any downside. You will have an extra 1st stage and an extra HP gauge if your only diving single tank. If/When you add a pony bottle, H valve, or doubles... you will end up paying a lot more to upgrade to the extra parts.

Also Tbone - I hear they don't sell the DR service manual anymore. How can I get my hands on one? I'm sure you know a source (PDF or ebay or?)

There is at least one of the DR manuals available online. frogkick.com.... ??

 

[tbone1004]

frogkick.dk not .com, but that is an old DR manual that is from a different OEM than the current one. Not that it really matters, but the Apeks one is perfectly sufficient.

 

[filmguy123]

Regarding the DiveRite, you said this:

Not really any downside. You will have an extra 1st stage and an extra HP gauge if your only diving single tank. If/When you add a pony bottle, H valve, or doubles... you will end up paying a lot more to upgrade to the extra parts.

Confused - where/when will I end up paying a lot more to upgrade to the extra parts?? If I go with the linked DiveRite package, of if i do NOT go with that package and opt for something else? I thought the DR kit was basically set up for all that stuff out of the box.

Ok, so DIN 1st stage + a Yoke adapter has only one downside: 1 inch of closer to head discomfort, which is largely mitigated by rotating ports on a first stage that has this feature? Buy a yoke 1st stage will give me problems with a GUE class and not allow me to take advantage of the pros of DIN diving. Correct?

Tanks, Tanks, Tanks. Talk to me about tanks. Which kind of tanks use DIN, which use Yoke, why is DIN better? Furthermore, all this talk of AL tanks VS Steel tanks... are all higher capacity tanks Steel (like a 100 or 120, 130, etc.)? If so, why? Advantages/Disadvantages to each, and when/why am I like to see one or the other? Will I need DIN to take advantage of diving larger capacity tanks? Or Steel tanks? Or both? Thanks for helping me sort this out.

Lastly: One brand I don't hear mentioned in this thread is Aqualung. Why not?

 

[scubadada]

Regarding the DiveRite, you said this:



Confused - where/when will I end up paying a lot more to upgrade to the extra parts?? If I go with the linked DiveRite package, of if i do NOT go with that package and opt for something else? I thought the DR kit was basically set up for all that stuff out of the box.

Ok, so DIN 1st stage + a Yoke adapter has only one downside: 1 inch of closer to head discomfort, which is largely mitigated by rotating ports on a first stage that has this feature? Buy a yoke 1st stage will give me problems with a GUE class and not allow me to take advantage of the pros of DIN diving. Correct?

Tanks, Tanks, Tanks. Talk to me about tanks. Which kind of tanks use DIN, which use Yoke, why is DIN better? Furthermore, all this talk of AL tanks VS Steel tanks... are all higher capacity tanks Steel (like a 100 or 120, 130, etc.)? If so, why? Advantages/Disadvantages to each, and when/why am I like to see one or the other? Will I need DIN to take advantage of diving larger capacity tanks? Or Steel tanks? Or both? Thanks for helping me sort this out.

Lastly: One brand I don't hear mentioned in this thread is Aqualung. Why not?

Hi filmguy,

Sorry to say, but you have a huge knowledge deficit. If you'll always rent tanks, a yoke system is fine, the majority of rented AL80s are yoke, though they may have a DIN alternative. The DIN connection is preferable and is what you would want on your own steel tanks. Steel tanks have better buoyancy characteristics over AL tanks. There is so much information on SB, I'm surprised you have so many questions.

Good diving, Craig

 

[Lorenzoid]

There must be dozens of threads in which DIN versus yoke has been discussed. A simple Google search along the lines of site:scubaboard.com DIN yoke might reveal much of interest.

 

[Caveeagle]

Regarding the DiveRite, you said this:



Confused - where/when will I end up paying a lot more to upgrade to the extra parts?? If I go with the linked DiveRite package, of if i do NOT go with that package and opt for something else? I thought the DR kit was basically set up for all that stuff out of the box.

There is no downside to the Getting the Dive Rite Reg package. I assume you will be diving single tank initially, so this kit will (with 2x 1st stages and 2x SPG) will be more gear than you need initially. So that is an upside! Especially if you end up needing then down the road, or just to keep as spares.

Ok, so DIN 1st stage + a Yoke adapter has only one downside: 1 inch of closer to head discomfort, which is largely mitigated by rotating ports on a first stage that has this feature? Buy a yoke 1st stage will give me problems with a GUE class and not allow me to take advantage of the pros of DIN diving. Correct?

I am not a drinker of the GUE Kool Aid, so you will have to listen to others on flavor preference. I will say that buying DIN regs will set you up better for any Tech or advanced training. **Full Disclosure** there is a nice colorful thread here last week with some complaining about people (like me) recommending DIN regs for new divers. You should read that and make up your own mind.

Tanks, Tanks, Tanks. Talk to me about tanks. Which kind of tanks use DIN, which use Yoke, why is DIN better? Furthermore, all this talk of AL tanks VS Steel tanks... are all higher capacity tanks Steel (like a 100 or 120, 130, etc.)? If so, why? Advantages/Disadvantages to each, and when/why am I like to see one or the other? Will I need DIN to take advantage of diving larger capacity tanks? Or Steel tanks? Or both? Thanks for helping me sort this out.

Pretty much any tank can be DIN or Yoke, (or a DIN/Yoke convertible) valve. It just depends on what is common and available in your area. It seems like Dive operators I have notices are starting to have more steel tanks, with more DIN(convertible) valves on them. This just might be because over time they are upgrading to a more popular standard. Or because of more Tech centric divers are asking for them.

Many Steel tanks are 'High Capacity' but that's not because they are steel. I am sitting right next to a set of steel 72s that I love. And try to find a used set of steel 50s. There is likely to be a fight over them in my next of the woods. Some people really like steel tanks because they tend to have better buoyancy traits. ie: they are typically close to neutral (not floaty) when empty, so you can wear less weight. There are also other reasons: They last longer than typical aluminum tanks, more durable to hydro stress. They hold value better for resale etc.

**There are different pressure ratings for steel tanks, but they are typically referred to as 'Low Pressure' or 'High Pressure' tanks. Preference is a regional thing, and I won't get into that. Look into what is popular in your area, but you can't go wrong with a HP100. I think Tbone suggested some LP130 a few posts back. Those are big tanks, and might be a good option. Slap an H valve on that babies and you have a nice redundant single tank rig that gives you plenty of gas.

Lastly: One brand I don't hear mentioned in this thread is Aqualung. Why not?

Nothing wrong with them from what I know. It will fall into the category of a premium price, with dealer only parts and service. If you are going to have a local shop do all your service, these might be a good option.

 

[filmguy123]

Well then, I suppose we can move on from the DIN/Yoke and those items and focus more on the main questions then! I'll look into that tangent discussion in more depth

Caveeagle - super helpful, thank you!

 

[tbone1004]

Regarding the DiveRite, you said this:



Confused - where/when will I end up paying a lot more to upgrade to the extra parts?? If I go with the linked DiveRite package, of if i do NOT go with that package and opt for something else? I thought the DR kit was basically set up for all that stuff out of the box.

Ok, so DIN 1st stage + a Yoke adapter has only one downside: 1 inch of closer to head discomfort, which is largely mitigated by rotating ports on a first stage that has this feature? Buy a yoke 1st stage will give me problems with a GUE class and not allow me to take advantage of the pros of DIN diving. Correct?

Tanks, Tanks, Tanks. Talk to me about tanks. Which kind of tanks use DIN, which use Yoke, why is DIN better? Furthermore, all this talk of AL tanks VS Steel tanks... are all higher capacity tanks Steel (like a 100 or 120, 130, etc.)? If so, why? Advantages/Disadvantages to each, and when/why am I like to see one or the other? Will I need DIN to take advantage of diving larger capacity tanks? Or Steel tanks? Or both? Thanks for helping me sort this out.

Lastly: One brand I don't hear mentioned in this thread is Aqualung. Why not?

if you buy a singles regulator set now, and have to buy a separate first stage and SPG, it will cost you about $250 for the first stage, and $80 for the SPG, so if the difference in cost of the singles reg set and the doubles reg set is less than $300 you are doing good. Streamlined OW Dive Rite set from DGX is $600, sidemount package from CA is $700. So you save at least $200, but realistically closer to $300 by buying the sidemount set now instead of having to buy the extra first stage later

Read around on forums for tanks, or just buy the HP130's that I linked on craigstlist. Any tank can accept DIN except the VERY old 1/2" pipe thread tanks, but those aren't common. Some steel tanks can't accept yoke, but those haven't been made in almost 20 years *I own quite a few and they're awesome, but they are 300 bar din only per the DOT*

Aqualung owns Apeks, Apeks makes better regs for technical diving due to the DST and reversible second stages, but have the same restrictions mentioned earlier in terms of parts availability, and warranty based on maintenance schedules. Very annoying. They're good regs though, but if you are talking GUE, you are talking technical diving, and you don't see them in technical diving unless someone is sponsored, but that is rare, they will usually go to Apeks if they want that brand.

realistically I'd have the mods merge your two threads you started today as there is a lot of overlap

 

[halocline]

If you are a new diver, doing recreational dives on single tanks, mostly renting, get a yoke regulator for single tank, NOT a din set up for double tanks. Some people are way over complicating this with their advice, and confusing their dive interests with yours.

By the time you start thinking about GUE classes and doubles, you'll hopefully be a much more experienced diver and you'll be spending money on a lot of gear; the regulators are the least of it. Do you have a dry suit yet? How about a BP/W? Or a canister light? Doubles? Ready to spend thousands on technical training? It might be better to get some dive experience first without mortgaging your house for expensive dive gear, then you can buy gear as you need it, with more experience on your side to make good decisions.

Buy a decent quality sealed regulator; HOG or dive rite are fine, SP MK17 is fine, apeks is fine, they're all fine. They all basically do the same thing, which is reduce the tank pressure to ambient so it's convenient to breathe. They all do a good job at this. There's an absurd amount of hype about these very simple devices.

The big issue over time is service-ability, and for that, you should decide now whether you intend to service them yourself or have someone else do it. If it's someone else, it's not a bad idea to figure out who that will be. Make sure you get regulators that this individual or shop can service. There's nothing wrong with sending your regs off for service; in fact, local shop service techs are a real crap shoot at best. Considering how easy it is to work on these devices, it's pretty discouraging how incompetent so many shops' techs are. I'm a little jaded as you might guess.

If you want to save money, buy a used regulator and service it yourself. The used market for regulators is totally a buyer's market. They don't really "wear out" and they haven't really improved in many years. The problem is getting parts and schematics. Most companies restrict those due to ridiculous policies based on the false premise that regulators are "life support" and end users can't be trusted to work on them. Then they hire techs that take a certification course that lasts one weekend and is impossible to fail. So much for the "life support" idea!

HOG has been somewhat of a pioneer in making service materials available to end users, but there are some requirements, and you should learn about them. I use old SP regs because there is an active grey market for parts; I have never had a problem getting parts for any of my regs, most of which are more than 20 years old. If you're in very cold water, you do want a sealed regulator, and that limits you with regards to SP. The MK17 is the only one, but it's a good one.

Good luck, have fun, don't spend too much! Save your money for important things like beer.

 

[filmguy123]

Any thoughts on:

Halcyon Regulators (and a kit?)
Zeagle F8 Regulators (and a kit?)