Liveaboard Tipping

[vladimir]

As I former liveaboard worker on a very well renowned australian dive boat (have a guess- there's not that many!) It's great to see that you guys really appreciate the workers and feel this should be reflected in tipping the crew. The way our boat worked, all the tips were pooled and split between a crew of 10 (except for any given to us specifically as personal tips), usually resulting in around $100-150 extra added to our measly pay packet. The liveaboard is something you work on for "the love of it" not the money, and I personally put in more than my fare share of 20 hour days. It goes without saying, that the weeks where American passengers were the minority, our tips really did suffer, and although sometimes you guys could be hard work (lol) we really appreciated the little bit extra that tips add.

The Spoilsport had fabulous crews on both of my trips. They really did seem to love their jobs.

 

[highdesert]

I didn't see these points brought up in the first 50 or so posts, so apologies if they were covered after that ...

1) Re: Cash vs credit card for a liveaboard tip ... in many countries, a credit card is just not possible on a liveaboard, short of someone copying your card info by hand and processing it ashore later, usually with a 4% or so processing charge added.

2) I'm not taking sides here on this issue, because it's one I wonder about often. Assume you're on a remote liveaboard that covers a large area. We've done nearly 900 miles on an 11-night trip. That consumes a considerable amount of fuel, which today comes at considerable cost. Since I paid for said fuel up front in my trip cost, what was the trip cost after deducting the fuel? Or is fuel a service, for which I must tip? If it's just a commodity, and I tip 10% on the whole trip cost, does that mean that I tipped well beyond 10% for the remaining services? Or am I a cheesy tightwad if I even make that consideration (can't wait to hear the replies on that point)?

 

[koozemani]

I guess you would need to see an itemized bill from the lob office. When you eat at a restaurant, fuel, utilities, rent, advertising, etc etc are all factored in to the price for that meal you just ordered, but you still tip on the amount of the bill. Heck, most people calculate the tip on the post tax total. That is where I draw the line, a percentage based on the bill pretax.

 

[Wookie]

I didn't see these points brought up in the first 50 or so posts, so apologies if they were covered after that ...

1) Re: Cash vs credit card for a liveaboard tip ... in many countries, a credit card is just not possible on a liveaboard, short of someone copying your card info by hand and processing it ashore later, usually with a 4% or so processing charge added.

2) I'm not taking sides here on this issue, because it's one I wonder about often. Assume you're on a remote liveaboard that covers a large area. We've done nearly 900 miles on an 11-night trip. That consumes a considerable amount of fuel, which today comes at considerable cost. Since I paid for said fuel up front in my trip cost, what was the trip cost after deducting the fuel? Or is fuel a service, for which I must tip? If it's just a commodity, and I tip 10% on the whole trip cost, does that mean that I tipped well beyond 10% for the remaining services? Or am I a cheesy tightwad if I even make that consideration (can't wait to hear the replies on that point)?

You didn't pay the tip on the service, that would be a service charge. You pay your tip based on the price of the charter. Do you go into a restaurant and ask the manager how much the power bill was for your little portion of the meal, or how much the lettuce was for your side salad, or how much the rent might be so you can divide it out by the number of meals plated per month? The fuel is a expense of the liveaboard, and, quite frankly, the cost isn't any of your business. If I fuel in Key West, I pay a premium over what I pay in Fort Lauderdale, but far less than I'd pay in Nassau. If you ride on my boat, I have 3 engines so your chances of getting home in a timely fashion are greatly enhanced. A boat like mine that has only 2 doesn't burn quite as much fuel. Will you penalize my crew because I have redundant systems for your comfort, enjoyment, and safety?

 

[Lorenzoid]

. . .
Since I paid for said fuel up front in my trip cost, what was the trip cost after deducting the fuel? Or is fuel a service, for which I must tip? . . . .

Well, you tip a taxi driver (in the US, at least) based on the fare, which presumably factors in all the costs associated with operating the taxi--fuel, maintenance, etc.

In the US, though, tips are not really closely tied to the idea of a reward for good service anymore; rather, a tip nowadays is simply part of the employee's expected compensation, and that fact is taken into account when the employer sets the employee's wage. (Some employees legally can be paid less than the normal minimum wage that applies to everyone else if they are expected to receive tips.) This is not so in many other parts of the world, where employees are "fully" compensated by their employers. By "fully" in quotations I mean they could be well compensated in some instances (take parts of Europe, for example, where waiters get full wages, paid vacation, and maybe even pensions) or poorly compensated in some instances (for example, divemasters who are paid just enough to scrape by)--but in either case, what their employers pay them is understood by all to be their "full" compensation. Now, we Americans go all over the world and tip people like we do back home for US employees who are not fully compensated by their employers. I believe the expansion of the American tipping tradition to other parts of the world is much appreciated. And I myself tend to tip like the American I am. But at the same time I keep in mind the people I am tipping are probably considered to be already fully compensated to whatever extent that may be in their economic world. It is not easy to factor all of this in, as the length of this thread demonstrates. Tipping is a squirrely thing.

 

[wayne007]

Folks:

---------- Post added April 5th, 2012 at 04:02 PM ----------

Folks:
Thanks for the advice! Seems like I hit a nerve (2800 views). A lot of good ideas though.

Thanks
Wayne

 

[hypertech]

You didn't pay the tip on the service, that would be a service charge. You pay your tip based on the price of the charter. Do you go into a restaurant and ask the manager how much the power bill was for your little portion of the meal, or how much the lettuce was for your side salad, or how much the rent might be so you can divide it out by the number of meals plated per month? The fuel is a expense of the liveaboard, and, quite frankly, the cost isn't any of your business. If I fuel in Key West, I pay a premium over what I pay in Fort Lauderdale, but far less than I'd pay in Nassau. If you ride on my boat, I have 3 engines so your chances of getting home in a timely fashion are greatly enhanced. A boat like mine that has only 2 doesn't burn quite as much fuel. Will you penalize my crew because I have redundant systems for your comfort, enjoyment, and safety?

I think the point of the post has been missed. Take your example, say I pay a premium in the charter cost so that I can ride on a boat like yours with an extra engine to make sure I get home in a timely fashion. Say that is an added value that I am willing to pay for. Thus, you, the boat owner, have been compensated for that offering by the premium I paid on the charter cost.

Now, compare two crews running otherwise identical boats and offering otherwise identical service but for the availability of the extra engine. The service offered by the crew is not affected by your extra engine for which I have paid extra. Is it right then that your crew would receive a surplus on the tip because I paid more for the charter over the other crew that worked just as hard and offered the same level of service? The right answer would appear to be no. The service was the same and the tip should be the same. So, it is not a question of penalizing your crew, but rather a question of why should the tip increase for a cost that has nothing to do with the service performed by the crew?

 

[chinacat46]

I think the point of the post has been missed. Take your example, say I pay a premium in the charter cost so that I can ride on a boat like yours with an extra engine to make sure I get home in a timely fashion. Say that is an added value that I am willing to pay for. Thus, you, the boat owner, have been compensated for that offering by the premium I paid on the charter cost.

Now, compare two crews running otherwise identical boats and offering otherwise identical service but for the availability of the extra engine. The service offered by the crew is not affected by your extra engine for which I have paid extra. Is it right then that your crew would receive a surplus on the tip because I paid more for the charter over the other crew that worked just as hard and offered the same level of service? The right answer would appear to be no. The service was the same and the tip should be the same. So, it is not a question of penalizing your crew, but rather a question of why should the tip increase for a cost that has nothing to do with the service performed by the crew?

This is exactly why I said in post #6 that I tip $40-$50 a day. If a trip cost $2000 or $4000 for a 7 day trip why should the people working get tipped different if the service is the same I don't like the idea of percentage of the cost.

 

[Wookie]

This is exactly why I said in post #6 that I tip $40-$50 a day. If a trip cost $2000 or $4000 for a 7 day trip why should the people working get tipped different if the service is the same I don't like the idea of percentage of the cost.

I think the point of the post has been missed. Take your example, say I pay a premium in the charter cost so that I can ride on a boat like yours with an extra engine to make sure I get home in a timely fashion. Say that is an added value that I am willing to pay for. Thus, you, the boat owner, have been compensated for that offering by the premium I paid on the charter cost.

Now, compare two crews running otherwise identical boats and offering otherwise identical service but for the availability of the extra engine. The service offered by the crew is not affected by your extra engine for which I have paid extra. Is it right then that your crew would receive a surplus on the tip because I paid more for the charter over the other crew that worked just as hard and offered the same level of service? The right answer would appear to be no. The service was the same and the tip should be the same. So, it is not a question of penalizing your crew, but rather a question of why should the tip increase for a cost that has nothing to do with the service performed by the crew?

You are right, I did miss your point, and I don't disagree with your stand here. I think it's fine to tip the crew a set amount per day regardless of the trip cost. A trip on a fancy 2 engine boat with the same hull as mine carrying 16 passengers is in the $2500 to $3000 range, where the equivalent trip with me carrying up to 24 passengers is in the $1500 range. Liveaboard operators suggest a percentage of the trip cost because it is easy, memorable, and standard, kind of like $5 or $10 per tank on a day boat.

 

[H2O Gal]

Wayne007-about 5 years ago I inadvertantly started a firestorm asking the same question!