little help...tank fails and destroyed

[NOVIZWHIZ]

haven't been here in awhile so "Howdy!", got a question -..I recently sent one of my tanks to be hydro'd., tank was 4 years old, I know - 5 years is the limit, but had a bunch going and just threw it in. Company did a hydro and an "edy" test??? The tank failed the edy and was condemned - company destoyed the threads in the neck and sent it back...tank is only 4 years old - I just lost 4 to the pre-1987 tank manufacture fiaso - does Luxfer have a guarantee on these things? Should the company have destroyed the tank? I had one fail vip(+) a few years ago in local shop, sent it back to Luxfer and they cleared it (BTW- not the same tank). Am I shafted?

 

[Nemrod]

You got shafted allright but not by Luxfer. N

 

[NOVIZWHIZ]

yep, that's what I figure, ...is that an industry policy to destroy a tank if it "fails"?

 

[Web Monkey]

haven't been here in awhile so "Howdy!", got a question -..I recently sent one of my tanks to be hydro'd., tank was 4 years old, I know - 5 years is the limit, but had a bunch going and just threw it in. Company did a hydro and an "edy" test??? The tank failed the edy and was condemned - company destoyed the threads in the neck and sent it back...tank is only 4 years old - I just lost 4 to the pre-1987 tank manufacture fiaso - does Luxfer have a guarantee on these things? Should the company have destroyed the tank? I had one fail vip(+) a few years ago in local shop, sent it back to Luxfer and they cleared it (BTW- not the same tank). Am I shafted?

The answer depends on if you trust the company doing the tank inspections.

I'm not surprised you lost 4 pre-1987 tanks. Some old aluminum tanks had a poor safety record and I've never seen a shop that would fill one anyway, so it's no great loss.

The eddy-current test detects neck cracks in the thread area. It's not a difficult test to perform and there isn't a lot of "wiggle room". At least on our tester, the cracks show up right on the computer screen. If your tank truly did fail the eddy-current test, you should thank the tank inspector, since he saved you (or the tank-fill guy) from a catastrophic explosion.

You're out of luck on the 4 old tanks, but if the new one really had a neck crack, you should contact the manufacturer. They might replace it for you.

Terry

 

[NOVIZWHIZ]

The answer depends on if you trust the company doing the tank inspections.

I'm not surprised you lost 4 pre-1987 tanks. Some old aluminum tanks had a poor safety record and I've never seen a shop that would fill one anyway, so it's no great loss.

The eddy-current test detects neck cracks in the thread area. It's not a difficult test to perform and there isn't a lot of "wiggle room". At least on our tester, the cracks show up right on the computer screen. If your tank truly did fail the eddy-current test, you should thank the tank inspector, since he saved you (or the tank-fill guy) from a catastrophic explosion.

You're out of luck on the 4 old tanks, but if the new one really had a neck crack, you should contact the manufacturer. They might replace it for you.

Terry

Sorry, wasn't clear on the old tanks, they weren't in this lot. l tossed them awhile back and bought 4 new ones. One of the new 4 failed an eddy current test at my local shop (about 3 years ago during first VIP when it was a year old). Sent it back to Luxfer and they checked it as okay. Sent the same four out for hydro (and eddy) this time and a different one failed eddy...but this time didn't have the opportunity for a
"2nd opinion", they just jammed the threads. Just saying I had a "failure" once that wasn't - wondering how accurate some of these tests are? If a certified company says it's bad - it's bad and the manufacturer should stand behind it.

 

[Web Monkey]

Sorry, wasn't clear on the old tanks, they weren't in this lot. l tossed them awhile back and bought 4 new ones. One of the new 4 failed an eddy current test at my local shop (about 3 years ago during first VIP when it was a year old). Sent it back to Luxfer and they checked it as okay. Sent the same four out for hydro (and eddy) this time and a different one failed eddy...but this time didn't have the opportunity for a
"2nd opinion", they just jammed the threads. Just saying I had a "failure" once that wasn't - wondering how accurate some of these tests are? If a certified company says it's bad - it's bad and the manufacturer should stand behind it.

That's different. The manufacturer has no reasonably easy way to verify the defect if the inspection company destroyed the threads, although if they wanted to work at it hard enough, or if the crack was huge enough, they might sill be able to see it.

You probably got hosed, but I have no idea how you could verify it, since AFAIK, a tank with inoperable threads can't be re-eddy'd (can't get the probe back down through the neck). You could demand a printout from the inspection, but there's no way to prove that the printout they give you was actually from your tank.

Condemning a cylinder generally involves defacing the DOT # or Serial #, not screwing up the threads. The shop that did the inspection owes you a new tank.

See: http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_2006/octqtr/pdf/49cfr180.207.pdf

Terry

 

[Black Jack]

Fully agree. We show folks where the problem is. Now you have to "trust" them that the tank was bad. I'd be talking seriously with the owner as Luxfor is not about to warranty a tank that can't be tested now. Good luck!

 

[Web Monkey]

Condemning a cylinder generally involves defacing the DOT # or Serial #, not screwing up the threads. The shop that did the inspection owes you a new tank.

See: http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_2006/octqtr/pdf/49cfr180.207.pdf

You might want to print out the DOT regulations for condemning a cylinder (the link above) and bring it into the shop and show it to the owner. Given how they treated your tank, they probably don't want to have the DOT poking around examining their inspection procedures.

I suspect you'll walk out with a shiny new tank in exchange for not making a big deal out of their screw-up.

Terry

 

[Lead_carrier]

haven't been here in awhile so "Howdy!", got a question -..I recently sent one of my tanks to be hydro'd., tank was 4 years old, I know - 5 years is the limit, but had a bunch going and just threw it in. Company did a hydro and an "edy" test??? The tank failed the edy and was condemned - company destoyed the threads in the neck and sent it back...tank is only 4 years old - I just lost 4 to the pre-1987 tank manufacture fiaso - does Luxfer have a guarantee on these things? Should the company have destroyed the tank? I had one fail vip(+) a few years ago in local shop, sent it back to Luxfer and they cleared it (BTW- not the same tank). Am I shafted?

If this was a NEW Luxfer the I would definitely print out the DOT standards and take to them since this would be one of the first, to my knowledge, of the new tanks having cracks in the neck. Or they could be using the orginal Visual Plus machine to test; it is not considered reliable by Luxfer on the 6061 tanks. Luxfer: Press Releases

Either way, I'd have a serious word of prayer with the dive shop about screwing up the neck. X'ing the serial number will suffice.

Personally, I would just as soon condemn ALL 6351 tanks and use only the 6061 tanks.

 

[DennisW]

Eddy current testing is not valid on new tanks, so they should not even be doing it on a new 6061 alloy tank. They screwed you because they have no clue what they are doing. I would be asking them for a new tank. I probably wouldn't get one, but I would let everyone on this board and all other boards know what facility this is. If I lived in your area, I would want to know. They should lose all of their business.