Leisure pro - voided warranty????

[sphillips3]

I would call that more their "Public" position.


I think everyone pretty much understands that for LP to get as much SP and AL product that they do, that it involves manufacturer/distributor direct or indirect participation.

How do you punish a LDS that has already gone out of buisiness or has lost their dealership? Much of the LP stock comes from dive shops closing their doors or changing what lines they chose to stock - they unload a bunch of stuff and get a check from LP. The manufacturer has no leverage becuse the shop is either out of buisiness or a dealer for another line.

Of course, the manufacturer *could* buy the stock back at a reasonable price but I doubt that happens very often.

 

[mike_s]

I suspect there's some thruth to that.

If AL really wanted to stop LP and shut down that distribution channel it would be easy to obtain a few pieces of their own equipment from LP and trace where the sale originated....

Why would AL want to shut down the distribution to LP when they are the ones providing it and profiting from it?

LP sells over a million bucks of AL, Apeks, Sequest, etc divegear a year. AL isn't going to stop that.

How do you punish a LDS that has already gone out of buisiness or has lost their dealership? Much of the LP stock comes from dive shops closing their doors or changing what lines they chose to stock - they unload a bunch of stuff and get a check from LP. The manufacturer has no leverage becuse the shop is either out of buisiness or a dealer for another line.

Of course, the manufacturer *could* buy the stock back at a reasonable price but I doubt that happens very often.

I'm sure that LP buys some stuff from dive shops for some manufacturers... but some/most of them ship direct.

read the example I stated above about how LP had the "ACD" regulators in stock selling them before the bigger dealers could even get them. You don't get that via a "shop going out of business selling to LP". You get that direct. it doesn't get much simpler than that.


Leisure Pro reads these threads.... the manufacturer reads these threads, but neither of them is going to come on here and reveal how they are shipping their product directly or indirectly to LP. (but that's to be expected).

Leisure Pro, Adorama (camera), real estate development companies, and 10's of millions of dollars of real estate and rental property/buildings in New York are owned by Eugene Mendlowits. He's a multi-millionaire. He didn't get that way by buying and selling "scraps" from dealers going out of business.

 

[BlueFrog]

Mike S and others are correct. Why would AL or SP want to restrict their largest distributor? LP might make a special purchase when a LDS closes but they don't have buyers flying all over the world to buy a couple of regs or BCDs at a time. Even if every shop in the US that closed called LP with their entire inventory of SP and AL, they wouldn't be able to meet LP's demand.

The whole Leisure Pro/Aqua Lung/ScubaPro issue is so old and tired that it's really a pointless discussion. Leisure Pro isn't going anywhere or changing their strategy because they're winning and yes, they've caused many LDS to close and will continue to do so. They don't do anything illegal so the debate is a waste of time.

Back to the original question, if price is your only motivation then its hard to argue that LP isn't the way to go. LP is selling SP regs for less than the LDS around here can buy wholesale from the factory.

 

[sell66]

Ok, I will see if the LDS will give me a deal on gear. If it's not too much more expensive i'll buy from them.

What do you guys recommend for a computer and regular? Ill be doing 95% Los Angeles shore/beach dives,

For my reg. i'm debating between the AL Tital LX or ScubaPRO M25/S555.

For my computer i'm debating between the Cressi-Sub Archimede II 3 Gauge Computer Console or Suunto Gekko. (needs to have analog compass, and pressure gauge)

Thanks,

David

p.s. This board rocks!

 

[mike_s]

Ok, I will see if the LDS will give me a deal on gear. If it's not too much more expensive i'll buy from them.

if you can get it for a deal close to what LP has it for, I'd go with your LDS hands down....

What do you guys recommend for a computer and regular? Ill be doing 95% Los Angeles shore/beach dives,

For my reg. i'm debating between the AL Tital LX or ScubaPRO M25/S555.

the AL Titan LX is a solid performer. you won't be unhappy with it.

if you want it environmentally sealed, you can get the Supreme upgrade kit for the Titan LX to accomplish that. (BTW... the Titan LX 2nd stage is the same internally as the Legend LX, their top of the line reg. (someone correct me if I'm wrong)).

I'll let someone else who knows the M25/S555 better answer for that.

For my computer i'm debating between the Cressi-Sub Archimede II 3 Gauge Computer Console or Suunto Gekko. (needs to have analog compass, and pressure gauge)
!

The Cressi-Sub Archimede II is made by Seiko as OEM for Cressi. You can buy the same computer with Dive Rite, Tusa, and Zeagle logo's on it. It's a solid computer with few complaints. you can get it in wrist mount also if you prefer that and keep your pressure/compass on your gauge console.

This computer supports two nitrox blend gasses, if later you decided to get into any diving where you'd switch gases, like to a pony bottle or deco bottle. or between air and nitrox on the same dive. It also computes "fly time" instead of giving the standard "24 hour disclaimer countdown".


The Gekko uses the RGBM decompression model, which is a little more conservative. The Cressi uses the Bühlmann ZH-L8 algorithm. (although the Tusa IQ-700 is listed as using the "swiss model" on some pages and it's the same computer. might be a firmware flash difference.). There are some articles on Scubadiving.com comparing the difference in the two algorithms

Both have user replaceable batteries. (a requirement for me).
The Cressi has "gauge mode" but the Gekko doesn't
The Cressi is downloadable vi PC interface, the Gekko isn't
The Gekko doesn't support two nitrox gas blends.
you can set your PO2 (limit) on the Cressi, but not on the Gekko
The Cressi holds 10 more dives in memory.
The Cressi has a "dive simulator" so you can practice using it on your couch at home.

 

[PhilEllis]

I certainly am not an expert on the issue and I am satisfied to let everyone else take guess about where LP gets the merchandise they sell. However, I will say that I HAVE NEVER HEARD ONE CREDIBLE REPORT that is comes from stores that are "going out of business". To begin with, must scuba stores in the United States have a level of retail sales that would require 30 or 40 years of sales to equal one year at LP. Furthermore, stores that are "going out of business" are not stocked full of inventory, especially not computers, regulators, buoyancy vests, and new "in the package" wetsuits.

So, if you are going to try to guess where the stuff comes from, you better have a more credible guess than the "going out of business" idea......no matter how much the manufactures would like to to believe it.

Added Note: Oh, it is probably a good idea to try something other than the "it all comes from Europe" idea also.

Phil Ellis
Discount Scuba Gear at DiveSports.com - Buy Scuba Diving Equipment & Snorkeling Equipment

How do you punish a LDS that has already gone out of buisiness or has lost their dealership? Much of the LP stock comes from dive shops closing their doors or changing what lines they chose to stock - they unload a bunch of stuff and get a check from LP. The manufacturer has no leverage becuse the shop is either out of buisiness or a dealer for another line.

Of course, the manufacturer *could* buy the stock back at a reasonable price but I doubt that happens very often.

 

[fnfalman]

Ok, I will see if the LDS will give me a deal on gear. If it's not too much more expensive i'll buy from them.

What do you guys recommend for a computer and regular? Ill be doing 95% Los Angeles shore/beach dives,

For my reg. i'm debating between the AL Tital LX or ScubaPRO M25/S555.

For my computer i'm debating between the Cressi-Sub Archimede II 3 Gauge Computer Console or Suunto Gekko. (needs to have analog compass, and pressure gauge)

Thanks,

David

p.s. This board rocks!

The Titan LX is a decent reg. It doesn't breath as well as the Atomic at depth, but it works. As you well know, I have the LX as my backup set of regulators. Go check with Eco Dive Center and see if they have any more Titan LX used ones for sales. Eco tend to phase their regulators out very often and they always refurbish these used regs before selling them off.

As far as Cressi goes, I try not to touch anything of Italian in origin that is important to my health. I own Italian motorcycles, but that's about as far as I'd trust Italian quality control.

Suunto makes solid dive comps but they use conservative algorithm. What this means is that if you were to dive with a buddy using a different computer, your dive comp may direct you to surface a lot sooner than his would. If that's not a problem, then all is cool. If that is a problem, then your buddy may not want to be buddy up with somebody who is limited by his computer for bottom time.

PS If you were to want to do a lot of shore diving, try to do away with a console. Get a computer that can be strapped to your wrist, get a compass strapped to your wrist and a small pressure gauge connected to your 1st stage and clip it to your side. Dragging a console through the surf and wave is a real pain. Deep Sea Supply in Pasadena has bungie cord mounts for several popular compasses and computers (primarily for Suunto and Oceanic/Mares/Aeris computers).

 

[fisherkid]

Both have user replaceable batteries. (a requirement for me).
The Cressi has "gauge mode" but the Gekko doesn't
The Cressi is downloadable vi PC interface, the Gekko isn't
The Gekko doesn't support two nitrox gas blends.
you can set your PO2 (limit) on the Cressi, but not on the Gekko
The Cressi holds 10 more dives in memory.
The Cressi has a "dive simulator" so you can practice using it on your couch at home.

Just a correction, you can set the P02 limit on the gekko. anywhere between 1.2 and 1.6

 

[phillybob]

Oceanic finally 'came out of the shadows' and now lists L.P. as an 'authorized retailer'.

 

[redacted]

Oceanic finally 'came out of the shadows' and now lists L.P. as an 'authorized retailer'.

What do you mean by "came out of the shadows". I believe that Oceanic was one of the few (maybe only) major manufacturers putting some real heat on LP. My guess is that Oceanic was successful enough to entice LP to accept their mfgr agreement and just become another competitively priced priced authorized Oceanic dealer. Unfortunately, some of the attractiveness of the deal is lost once that happens.