LCHF or Ketogenic Diet

[uncfnp]

How so?

Because you said you were interested in a cognizent discussion and it helps to know where you are coming from although I admit that based on your posts you do not seem truly openminded to the discussion. But I am willing to give it a try if you are seriouly interested.

You come from the tradition nutritional approach to health. I use to be squarely in this group as well. But recent personal and anedotal eexperience ad lead me to research less traditional thoughts on nutrrition.

 

[uncfnp]

I'd argue that my - admittedly insufficiently - a moderately active lifestyle keeps the body in tune with what it's evolved for and able to respond properly to conditions and its own hormone signals.

There's no magic bullet, even though people have been looking frantically for it for decades, perhaps even centuries. The LCHF/ketogenic diet is just another of those failed magic bullets, like the pineapple diet of the 60s. Eat a balanced diet, exercise properly, lead a physically active life (i.e. walk or bike, don't drive when possible) and quit chasing the magic bullet. That'll take you much further than subscribing to Atkins or any other prophets.

Storker. I am a poster child for the healthy eating and active lifestyle campaign. As I approached middle age then menopause it was failing me. (It wasn’t really working well before that) And I don’t think I am alone in this.

I ate healthy, I love food and cooking. I replaced my fats with low fat food. I ate whole grain. I have been active all my life. I was a member of a gym all my adult life until I moved to a rural area and then set up a home gym. I have a sophisticated home weight system, free weights, a professional spin bike and my most loved elliptical. I completed a modified P90x (modified because of rotator cuff tear and inability to completely repair surgically) in my early 50’s. I did yoga.

But all that has taken a toll on my joints. I mentioned the rotator cuff but that was years after repeated strains and injections. MY strength and ROM on the right is limited. Then a herniated cervical disc has left my left arm week. Most of yoga is now very difficult (and painful) for me.

But I degress. This was mostly to show that you are preaching to the choir. But I am a choir member that has found that the sheet music may not be what we were taught.

Telling me the solution is eating health and being active is falling on deaf ears. I no longer subscribe to this symphony.

 

[Mrs. B]

I'd argue that my - admittedly insufficiently - a moderately active lifestyle keeps the body in tune with what it's evolved for and able to respond properly to conditions and its own hormone signals.

There's no magic bullet, even though people have been looking frantically for it for decades, perhaps even centuries. The LCHF/ketogenic diet is just another of those failed magic bullets, like the pineapple diet of the 60s. Eat a balanced diet, exercise properly, lead a physically active life (i.e. walk or bike, don't drive when possible) and quit chasing the magic bullet. That'll take you much further than subscribing to Atkins or any other prophets.

Except that advice has failed to see better outcomes at the population level.
So, to continue with identical advice and the same high carbohydrate low fat dietary advice is to ignore the trend that began around 1980...

Low-fat diets have largely failed to live up to their promise of reducing the risk of obesity, cardiovascular disease, and diabetes. Randomized controlled trials over the last two decades have increasingly supported the position that higher-protein, lower-carbohydrate, higher-fat diets promote greater weight loss than low-fat diets.

 

[Storker]

Except that advice has failed to see better outcomes at the population level.

And why is that? Is it because the dietary advice is wrong, or is it because the general population doesn't follow the advice properly?

Low-fat diets have largely failed to live up to their promise of reducing the risk of obesity, cardiovascular disease, and diabetes.

The rational counterpoint to a LCHF diet isn't a high-carb low-fat diet, it's a balanced diet.

 

[uncfnp]

Storker. I know you don’t like links but this is something that if you are legitimately intereted in my reasons for dietary lifestyle changes (not diet) you will watch. And if you say you are not interested in what Dr Eric Westman with Duke University and the Duke Lifestyle Clinic has to,say about low carb then our discussion really is over.

 

[Storker]

Storker. I know you don’t like links

I love links. Cite, or shut up.

I dislike, however, YT videos thrown out without context nor a written summary.

 

[uncfnp]

I love links. I dislike, however, YT videos thrown out without context nor a written summary.

Then watch it and come back with your rational agaist what he says.

 

[Storker]

Nope. Summarise and make your argument. Then, I'll consider it. Just linking to a YT video is intellectual laziness.

 

[Dizzi Lizzi]

LOL the problem's as I see them are (in no particular order)
-we enjoy eating/we eat for pleasure not just to survive
-our metabolism changes several times throughout our life span
-our brains teach us the easy way to do things...hunter gatherers, cooking food , preserving food....
-that ability to stockpile food lets us take it easy and eat bon bons on the couch since we don't need to hunt every day
-we wear out our joints as we age, due to injury, repetitive motion....
-this aging of our musculoskeletal system makes exercise uncomfortable
-throughout our lifespan we must change our diets to meet our needs, newborns-elderly


Because of these (and more) dynamic and changing facets there will never be a magic bullet, but that same brain that allows us to enjoy food and eat for pleasure also allows us to develop techniques to adjust .

Now up off my chair and for a lap around the building (must avoid the cookies at the front desk!!!)

 

[Mrs. B]

the Westman paper (cited by 900 Google Scholar)

A Low-Carbohydrate, Ketogenic Diet versus a Low-Fat Diet To Treat Obesity and Hyperlipidemia: A Randomized, Controlled Trial

Conclusion
Compared with a low-fat diet, a low-carbohydrate diet program had better participant retention and greater weight loss. During active weight loss, serum triglyceride levels decreased more and high-density lipoprotein cholesterol level increased more with the low-carbohydrate diet than with the low-fat diet.

many confounders but the weight of the evidence not only appears to move in this direction, in the literature base, but triglycerides and HDL parameters improve and these are better predictions of cardiac risk than LDL