Is there an instructor crisis?

[TravelGas]

I said “most” lol. I’m fully aware that 2 edges are superior.

I just don’t like the insinuation that skiing instruction and diving instruction is on the same level. Ski lessons are for children and spouses so dedicated riders can get morning runs in without feeling guilty.

I’d NEVER drop anyone into a pool with dive gear and say go for it.

Funny you mention edges. I do unlimited tune ups each season. My edges are very sharp and I know how to wring the most out of it.
Not sure which ocean you are near, but if you would like to join me for a recreational / no pressure day, I have comp lift tickets for you or anyone else from this board for that matter.

 

[SKS22]

I find fascinating and worrying the degree to which this discussion mirrors others I have seen regarding lawyers, teachers and professors, cops, prison guards, medical doctors, and coaches. I bet there other professions that also feel this way, but members of them don't happen to be in my friend/family circle. Many people, both blue collar and white collar, feel under-valued. They see costs of living and working such as housing, tolls, insurance, vehicles, education (often required for their field) etc going up much faster than their wages. Some say it's been going on for years but now they're at a breaking point. Sometimes they know clients / customers are paying a lot, and they debate where all the money is going, other times they can't understand why customers don't value their work. Either way, the result for them is the same.

 

[Wookie]

Skiing vs diving is a terrible comparison when talking about instructors. I’d put money I can blow most of your doors off (on a snowboard no less) and I’ve never had or wanted a lesson.

@Wookie , you must not ride Tahoe very often if you’re calling our hills powdery. We have Sierra Cement 95% of the time

Ah, but I learned on ice. Literally ice. Come back east sometime.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Perhaps, my understanding and experience with Ski Resorts/ Ski Patrol/Volunteering as a First Responder is greater than my knowledge or experience in the Scuba world …

Having been a volunteer patroller and taking the Outdoor Emergency Technician source during a summer (2 long evenings for I don't remember how many weeks), followed by a winter of I don't remember how many days of sliding down the mountain with a sled strapped to my arse.

All the training I took as a scuba diver and as an instructor accumulated are still far less. If I subscribed to minimum requirements, even less so.

My perceptions (I don't have data, so this is coming from a dark, smelly place, there is no sled strapped right now to it) is that patrollers far more frequently deal with injuries. As an industry though, my perception (again, dark place) there are fewer fatalities.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

I just don’t like the insinuation that skiing instruction and diving instruction is on the same level. Ski lessons are for children and spouses so dedicated riders can get morning runs in without feeling guilty.

I took an extreme skiing (all mountain) course at Mt. Baker (where you knuckle draggers got your boards) to take my skiing to a new level. The instructors had various backgrounds: mogul racer from the northeast (he could barrel roll off anything) to even a ski jumper from a circus.

Most people in my area took ski lessons as a kid to get started. I took 4 which really helped (8th through 11th grade).

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

Agreed. A better analogy might be driving lessons....you can still get taught by a parent or sibling or friend, without paying, but you can't (legally) drive without a certification. Diving has tried to provide that certification without involving a government entity involved.....

A person can get a drivers license, which should mean that they know how to drive and are not careless, but there are no guarantees of either.
Side shows, driving like idiots on the freeway cutting off big rigs, driving like maniacs on back roads in sports cars thinking their in a Formula 1 race, etc. These are supposedly all “certified” or licensed drivers.
“Can be taught by a parent or friend” yes they can.
And why not for diving too?
Driving a car is actually a lot more involving of other people in other cars around you, it’s not just about you. With diving it can just be only about you and doesn’t necessarily affect other people unless you count a buddy.
Driving requires an official state issued license, diving does not. Diving certs are only a brownie button really that just say you took some course issued by a self regulating private organization. It really doesn’t have any legal power at a state or federal level. They are just a self appointed BOD that decided how things are going to go. The whole thing is really quite flimsy if you ask me.
Why can’t divers be taught to dive by a family member or friend? Then once they learn they could go to a place to take a test and get a plastic brownie button saying they know how to dive.
That’s pretty much what we have now except you have to go to an “official” teacher to get an “official” certification, and many of these official instructors are a joke.
If you ask me diving is some ways is MORE regulated than getting a drivers license.
I think the whole system that they’ve created is faulted and getting worse. It might have started out with good intentions but it’s corrupt. It’s expensive, it’s a barrier to entry, and it’s choking out diving.
But as long as “they” say we need to be certified, whoever “they” are, then we come up with proposals other than the way it is.
Beyond that, I think we explore the idea to do away with certifications because they aren’t worth the plastic they’re made out of.
Is there an instructor crisis? No, there’s a whole F-ing industry crisis!
If you are caught driving without a license, what do they do? Most likely they impound your car and you call someone to pick you up and then you pay a fine and you also pay to get your vehicle out if impound.
What happens if they catch you diving with no certification? Nothing.

 

[tursiops]

A person can get a drivers license, which should mean that they know how to drive and are not careless, but there are no guarantees of either.
Side shows, driving like idiots on the freeway cutting off big rigs, driving like maniacs on back roads in sports cars thinking their in a Formula 1 race, etc. These are supposedly all “certified” or licensed drivers.
“Can be taught by a parent or friend” yes they can.
And why not for diving too?
Driving a car is actually a lot more involving of other people in other cars around you, it’s not just about you. With diving it can just be only about you and doesn’t necessarily affect other people unless you count a buddy.
Driving requires an official state issued license, diving does not. Diving certs are only a brownie button really that just say you took some course issued by a self regulating private organization. It really doesn’t have any legal power at a state or federal level. They are just a self appointed BOD that decided how things are going to go. The whole thing is really quite flimsy if you ask me.
Why can’t divers be taught to dive by a family member or friend? Then once they learn they could go to a place to take a test and get a plastic brownie button saying they know how to dive.
That’s pretty much what we have now except you have to go to an “official” teacher to get an “official” certification, and many of these official instructors are a joke.
If you ask me diving is some ways is MORE regulated than getting a drivers license.
I think the whole system that they’ve created is faulted and getting worse. It might have started out with good intentions but it’s corrupt. It’s expensive, it’s a barrier to entry, and it’s choking out diving.
But as long as “they” say we need to be certified, whoever “they” are, then we come up with proposals other than the way it is.
Beyond that, I think we explore the idea to do away with certifications because they aren’t worth the plastic they’re made out of.
Is there an instructor crisis? No, there’s a whole F-ing industry crisis!
If you are caught driving without a license, what do they do? Most likely they impound your car and you call someone to pick you up and then you pay a fine and you also pay to get your vehicle out if impound.
What happens if they catch you diving with no certification? Nothing.

Do you feel better now?

 

[TravelGas]

I never realized that there were so many people here who ski. There is a sub forum for all possible things, something for everyone’s interest, except skiing. Maybe we need a ski sub forum for chat and trip reports? The width and breadth of knowledge on so many different subjects on this forum is impressive.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

Do you feel better now?

Yes, thank you

 

[berndo]

Why can’t divers be taught to dive by a family member or friend?

It doesn't really seem work great for driving either. AFAIK, the US has double or triple the amount of fatal traffic accidents per capita than European countries that require people to take lessons from an actual driving instructor.

Instructors might put too much lead in you pocket and maybe are not that great a lot of the time... but I'm not sure a random dad or uncle would to a better job. A PADI instructor has at least a 100 dives, uncle Bob might have 8 dives when he starts teaching.