Is there a valid reason for a pony bottle

[MaxBottomtime]

For some strange reason, I am actually not surprised that you do not understand that the two regulator setup on a manifold doubles is a redundant system.

Max, needing two first stages on your doubles because one happens to feed the BC and the other the drysuit, when those could both come off one post if needed, misses the essence of the question.

Why in your doubles do you have two second stages hooked to separate first stages that are completely isolatable? When only one second stage is used in the normal conduct of a dive. Surely the second is redundant, even from your definition.

I guess that's kinda true if you don't know how to work the valves.

Read this page. You may actually learn something. DIR-diver.com - Reg configuration doubles

 

[MichaelMc]

Read this page. You may actually learn something. DIR-diver.com - Reg configuration doubles

I've read the DIR and GUE doubles configuration pages several times in the past.

The point was that it gives you redundancy in the gear on you. Which some, even many, feel is good past a certain risk level. For some that might be 150', cold, and dark. For others it might be 60', or even 45, or 30'. Some might like that redundancy via a twin set, others might go with an appropriately sized pony, appropriately used.

You've chosen in your twin set to have redundancy for deep, to you, dives. Others might feel deep is rather shallower, and might want redundancy at a shallower level, and being shallower a suitable pony might suffice. You and they have made similar choices, redundancy past some point. You differ in mechanism and depth level, which is more a detail than a fundamental difference. Saying that your redundancy with a buddy at one depth is fine, but theirs with a buddy at a shallower depth is not, seems hypocritical.

 

[KenGordon]

that would mean you have an 80 or 100 on your back and you are slinging an 80 in front. Thats alot of changes in your balance and boyancy id guess. and you would have to bring along that sling. a pony sling is too small and the LDS at a tropical location aint gonna have it. So wouldnt it just be easier to bring a normal pony along anyway?

Until you use the pony it is not changing buoyancy. An ali80 is more or less neutral and not so heavy as the steel 3l ponies usually used here. The rig is exactly that used for a deco cylinder, but instead of a 7inch jubilee clip you use a cam band. So that comes down to 2ft bit of string, two clips, a cam band and may some bungee to hold the reg.

 

[KenGordon]

Because I have had too many instabuddies expect me to chase after them the entire dive.

The suggestion is to just let them swim off and carry on. You need to brief them that that is the plan so they don’t call the coast guard when they can’t find you. I suppose it depends on whether the vis is such they can be too far away for getting gas but still know they are still in the water.

 

[CWK]

Read this page. You may actually learn something. DIR-diver.com - Reg configuration doubles

The problem with instabuddies is that there are those who have no comprehension about what they are doing and pose an inherent danger to themselves and their buddies. I think your posts in this thread are most illuminating. I could never have envisaged how bad things could be. Thank you for sharing.

 

[Diving Dubai]

that would mean you have an 80 or 100 on your back and you are slinging an 80 in front. Thats alot of changes in your balance and boyancy id guess. and you would have to bring along that sling. a pony sling is too small and the LDS at a tropical location aint gonna have it. So wouldnt it just be easier to bring a normal pony along anyway?

Not necessarily:

For the tank sling you can either use Dive Rite Sling and then instead of the hose clip at the bottom, use a cam band. All my slings are set this way so that I can quickly and easily swap them between different cylinders to suit that trips diving. As long as you secure to loose end of the strap it's okay to use on a small cylinder like a Al 30 or 40

No real changes on balance - some people put 2lbs on the opposite side to teh slung cylinder, I don't bother because I don't notice any imbalance.

If you used the Al80 it would become a stage - you could use some of it's gas on each dive of the day and still have enough as a reserve on dive 3. In that way you wouldn't need a AL100 and could use a AL80. One symptom of high air consumption is the diver worrying about having high consumption (and being the first to call a dive). The fact you have way more gas than you need will probably cause you to relax and you'll see an improvement in your consumption.

However for your travelling scenario I would suggest a side mount rig is a more practicable solution to slinging an Al80 ad hoc. YMMV

 

[Mike1967]

One symptom of high air consumption is the diver worrying about having high consumption (and being the first to call a dive).

Me

The fact you have way more gas than you need will probably cause you to relax and you'll see an improvement in your consumption.

Exactly what has happened since I started diving SM

 

[RainPilot]

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[grf88]

The suggestion is to just let them swim off and carry on. You need to brief them that that is the plan so they don’t call the coast guard when they can’t find you. I suppose it depends on whether the vis is such they can be too far away for getting gas but still know they are still in the water.

No the suggestion is that they should stay close and giving them a reason to do so. Diving should be relaxing not a mad chase around the wreck or reef, something I am no longer willing to do. One comment that I frequently get from instabuddies is how much more they enjoyed the dive by slowing down.

 

[barth]

first off how long have you been diving? how many buddies do you now know? how long have you known this buddy? If I was diving 10 years or more id have tons of diving friends.


Second point, you went cave diving with instabuddies.....cool do they also average about 50 lifetime dives under their belt with an OW cert a single tank and a world of confidence? They dont do anything different like train in school for weeks and dozens and dozens and dozens of dives and practice ad infinitum buddy techniques do they? They arent DIR or GUE trained are they? because insta buddies are not trained like that.....


I dont want to break out the old apples to oranges theme because that doesnt begin to encompass the stretch you just made.


Ill have to break out the ol comparing amoebe to octopus comparison for your post....

When I started diving I was at a divingclub with padi divers. People were already telling me that it as not safe to dive with unknown divers you met from internet. But I didn't agree wih that. People are always telling me that is hard to find a good buddy. But I don’t think it’s hard to find a good buddy. Try to be a good buddy and don’t dive again with divers you don’t like.


If I want to do a tech dive to 51 meter that is possible for me with a unknown buddy. It is also possible for me to do a cavedive of 3 hours with an unknown buddy. I did both last year.


If you want to dive with a good buddy you should also be a good buddy by yourself. And sometimes you have to travel a longer distance. It will be harder to plan a trip with friends than just go diving with unknown buddy’s.


For me it makes diving more fun to have a good buddy and the same goal and plan during the dive. That is a choice I made.It’s easier complain about skills of other people and use a pony. That’s a choice you make. Everbody is responsible for his own choices. But when I dive single tank, my dives are safe enough to dive without pony. If I don't like a dive or buddy I will cancel the dive.