Is the DSS Thorus 25 Wing actually a horse shoe?!!!!

[Wingman_]

Yersterday as i was rinsing my newly bought DSS Thorus 25, i had quite a surprise. I filled the wing with clean water and then used the bottom purge to purge it but when the water stopped falling, half of the wing was still full of water!

That is A LOT of water that couldn't find its way to the purge. I even tried to hold the wing in a manner that the purge was the absolute lower part of the wing but there was no way for that water to find its way to the purge unless, like with a horshoe wing, i fully rotated the wing for the water to make it around the upper side and back to the purge side of the wing.

So I ask you all, Tobing in particular, how in the name of all that is holy is something like this possible?

 

[cool_hardware52]

Yersterday as i was rinsing my newly bought DSS Thorus 25, i had quite a surprise. I filled the wing with clean water and then used the bottom purge to purge it but when the water stopped falling, half of the wing was still full of water!

That is A LOT of water that couldn't find its way to the purge. I even tried to hold the wing in a manner that the purge was the absolute lower part of the wing but there was no way for that water to find its way to the purge unless, like with a horshoe wing, i fully rotated the wing for the water to make it around the upper side and back to the purge side of the wing.

So I ask you all, Tobing in particular, how in the name of all that is holy is something like this possible?

Would it seem prudent to risk my reputation by making false claims about the gear I design and sell? Have you found it useful to ask inflamitory questions to "all", most of whom have zero experience with the goods in question, before first posing the question to me? Have I been unwilling to answer any questions put to me via email or PM?

The Torus wings are all "Donuts" i.e. full circle bladders.

We do add an additional weld in the lower arc of the bladder, i.e. the portion of the wing that's between the lower section of the tank and your rear end.

This weld limits how much this part of the wing can inflate. This is so the wing cannot push on your butt when fully inflated.

Even with this weld there are still two sections of bladder that connect the lower portions of the bladder. Each of these sections is larger in cross section than the inflator hose, providing more than enough cross section for gas to migrate if necessary.

When the wings are mounted to a plate, and a tank secured (as if you were actually diving) the two long sides of the wing are held apart by the tank, and the lower arc is either straight or in a long radius curve, following the shape of the tank.

If the wing is demounted, as I assume it was when you cleaned it, the lower are can "Z" fold on itself, and the two long sides are no longer parallel, and can overlap at the bottom. This can fold the inner bladder back on itself.

Regards,


Tobin

 

[Jarrett]

I only see the LCD wings on the site. What are the Torus wings?

 

[Divin'Papaw]

Tobin has them on the site as well. You may have just missed the link as it is down a bit from the LCD link.

http://www.deepseasupply.com/page21.html

 

[cool_hardware52]

I only see the LCD wings on the site. What are the Torus wings?

Scroll down a bit, they are lower on the nav bar.

http://www.deepseasupply.com/page21.html

Tobin

 

[Rainer]

First, it's a "torus" wing (not thorus) [as in the shape], and it comes in either 26 lbs lift (not 25) or 35 lbs lift. They can be found here:

http://www.deepseasupply.com/page21.html

 

[*Floater*]

We do add an additional weld in the lower arc of the bladder, i.e. the portion of the wing that's between the lower section of the tank and your rear end.

This weld limits how much this part of the wing can inflate. This is so the wing cannot push on your butt when fully inflated.

Even with this weld there are still two sections of bladder that connect the lower portions of the bladder. Each of these sections is larger in cross section than the inflator hose, providing more than enough cross section for gas to migrate if necessary.

I assume without the weld you'd get another pound or two of lift out of the wing, right? I guess this extra lift would most likely be used on the surface, probably without the diver in the rig, so butt pushing would not be an issue during those times. Whether butt pushing would be an issue during the dive, I really cannot say. I don't recall ever experiencing such with my donuts, but then again I've never felt the need to pump them full while underwater. And while vertical on the surface, head above water, before or after the dive, the bottom of the wing is the last place the gas would go.

Anyway, I just don't see the point of putting the weld in because it seems to artificially reduce the wing's lift capacity without offering a significant benefit (to me at least), so I'm wondering if this was an issue during testing that you felt needed addressing? Did people complain about butt pushing? Or what exactly lead you to decide to put the weld in?

I know Oxycheq's Razor 50# has something similar in that the bladder connection at the rear is a narrow channel, but I don't see the point of that either in place of a wider channel. Seems like a needless sacrifice of lift capacity to me, so I'm trying to understand the reasoning behind it a little better.

 

[cool_hardware52]

Anyway, I just don't see the point of putting the weld in because it seems to artificially reduce the wing's lift capacity without offering a significant benefit (to me at least), so I'm wondering if this was an issue during testing that you felt needed addressing? Did people complain about butt pushing? Or what exactly lead you to decide to put the weld in?

The only time any wing is filled to capacity is at the surface, typically rescue senario, i.e. blow up the BC till the opv pops, ditch the weight belt, diver on their back, face up. Try floating relaxed, face up in the pool, now have somebody lift up you butt with their hand. What happens to your face?


Tobin

 

[Wingman_]

Tobin, i think you are overreacting. Can anyone honestly think after reading my post that i am unhappy with the wing? No, i am just asking a question because there was something there that i did not understand. This is a board concerning boyancy systems, everyone asks questions or emmit concerns about some gear they have or are planning to buy and i have yet to see another manufacturer other than you calling that inflamatory.

As you said yourself in the sentence "ask inflamatory questions", i was asking a question, which as far as i know cannot be inflamatory since it is a question. How can i "make false claims" when all i do is ask a question about a behaviour i don't fully understand? Inflamatory would be to come here and say "hey checkit out tobin sold me a horse shoe when i bought a doghnut". I didn't do that because i was pretty sure something was wrong in my reasoning, so i just came here and ask why. Granted my question was a bit too sensational, but that's just it and it's miles away from "making false claims".

How could anyone interested in your gear be discouraged by reading such a question? If anyone really is interested in your gear, like i was, and is looking into the BC section of the forum and reads a title like this, he will obviously click to see what it's inside and he will most definitly read your prompt reply. The only conclusion he could take from this is that you are available to answer any questions we have. People might actualy *learn* that you make O wings with this post like jarret did.

I am planning on posting a full review of the wing anyway when i feel i've tested it enough. I will also test this underwater but i can already say that i didn't notice it during my first dive so it all makes sense.

 

[vladimir]

So I ask you all, Tobing in particular, how in the name of all that is holy is something like this possible?

I'm not sure, but I think equating the wing with the spawn of the devil is at least a little bit inflammatory.