Instructors steering students to one agency or another?

[al248005]

This is for all of the instructors out there? I had a conversation tonight in the chat with an unnamed instructor. He said he teaches through two agencies which will not be named. He went on to say he starts all of his students out in one agency. If the student falls behind or can't master the skills required for that agency he switches them to other agency so they can get through because he states the requirements aren't as demanding. I found this rather odd and disturbing at the same time. Is this practice commonly used by most instructors around the world?

PS..not sure if this is the right place for this or not but I just put here because I don't have access to the instructor forum.

 

[pocky21]

Hah! The scuba equivalent of a GED!

That's not common practice to my knowledge. The few instructors I've known who teach for multiple agencies do so because they want to teach "their" class and the only difference at the end of the day is who you get the card from.

What the instructor you mention is doing is compromising his own standards by offering a "good enough" certification to avoid the investment of bringing poor performers up to speed. I would not recommend an instructor with these practices.

(coming from someone with a GED)

 

[ScubaInChicago]

Hopefully it's an eye opener that there are agencies that accept low standards and ones that don't. He/she can do some research and determine if they want to invest the time and energy to get their skills up to those standards and give it another go.

If it was truly the card they were after, no disappointment there...

 

[Goodtime Adventures]

As a dive centre that is dual rated (PADI & SSI) I cant say we've come across this before. I'd be skeptical of this particular instructor skimping on standards rather than one agency being easier than the other. For example with SSI and PADI there are some subtle differences between the two agencies in terms of skills - eg PADI must complete no mask swim, whereas in SSI mask removal/replacement suffices. However, with SSI, their teaching ethos (if taught in accordance with standards!) is based on learning through repetition, so while a couple of the skills may seem 'easier', students must complete them in confined and open water more times than PADI students, which pretty much balances it out.

 

[Superlyte27]

I'm pretty sure I could guess the agencies. I know an instructor who does this and quite simply.... what he's doing is not really wrong. The guy I know teaches for the agency that really does have the most demanding requirements to pass the class. I'm pretty sure you can guess which agency I'm talking about. Quite frankly, the requirements to pass a class with almost every other agency out there are not as strict. So, while the student might not be able to meet the strict requirements of the first agency, let's call them "FUEY", quite honestly, the student might actually meet the criteria of the other agency, (lets call them NACL). As long as the student meets the requirements of the agency for which he's receiving a card, I don't see a problem here.

Now, my standards are very high. There are lots of students who can't meet my requirements. And I teach for IANTD exclusively. But, the beauty of IANTD is that while they have minimum standards to which I must adhere to, an instructor can have higher standards with which to hold the student to. For example: Our coursework says you must demonstrate a mastery of a skill, not just an ability to perform it once. Well, can you do a full mask clear 10 times on a single breath? In my class you will. (If I still taught recreational classes anyway).

At any rate... I really don't see an issue with what the instructor is doing. It's not something I would do, but I can see why he's doing it as long as the student is reaching the requirements of the class for the card/agency he is issued.

 

[johnkendall]

I'm pretty sure I could guess the agencies. I know an instructor who does this and quite simply.... what he's doing is not really wrong. The guy I know teaches for the agency that really does have the most demanding requirements to pass the class. I'm pretty sure you can guess which agency I'm talking about. Quite frankly, the requirements to pass a class with almost every other agency out there are not as strict. So, while the student might not be able to meet the strict requirements of the first agency, let's call them "FUEY", quite honestly, the student might actually meet the criteria of the other agency, (lets call them NACL). As long as the student meets the requirements of the agency for which he's receiving a card, I don't see a problem here.

Now, my standards are very high. There are lots of students who can't meet my requirements. And I teach for IANTD exclusively. But, the beauty of IANTD is that while they have minimum standards to which I must adhere to, an instructor can have higher standards with which to hold the student to. For example: Our coursework says you must demonstrate a mastery of a skill, not just an ability to perform it once. Well, can you do a full mask clear 10 times on a single breath? In my class you will. (If I still taught recreational classes anyway).

At any rate... I really don't see an issue with what the instructor is doing. It's not something I would do, but I can see why he's doing it as long as the student is reaching the requirements of the class for the card/agency he is issued.

If you know an instructor actually doing this with "FUEY" then please let me know as it is a standards violation.

Thanks
John

 

[Superlyte27]

He's not certifying them with "FUEY", so I'm not sure what standards he's violating. The card they receive is from another agency.


-edit
Admittedly, I don't know everything (or even hardly anything) about "FUEY", so maybe there is something in their contract that says this isn't Kosher.

 

[johnkendall]

He's not certifying them with "FUEY", so I'm not sure what standards he's violating. The card they receive is from another agency.

If they start registered on a GUE class, and end up with a cert from a different agency then the instructor is violating GUE standards. GUE allows for dual certification as long as the student has complied with the requirements of both agencies, but a GUE instructor is not allowed to say "you're not good enough to pass the GUE class, so here is an xyz card instead"

 

[Superlyte27]

What's this GUE you're referring to? I was talking about "FUEY". LOL

 

[spc751]

If I paid to take a FUEY course and got a NACL card I would demand my money back and look for another instructor.