How do you secure your dive flag?

[BigAirHarper]

I was just curious to hear the many ways that people secure their dive flags at their dive sites. Let's say your doing an OW dive off the shore. I'm just wondering if you anchor it to the bottom, or tie it off elsewhere.

 

[Becca_007]

You drag it with you or otherwise how does it mark where you are? We do lots of shore dives in Michigan. The flag is in a float and there is a rope around a plastic handle. Let out rope as you go deeper and reel it in if you ascend. Keeping the flag right above you lets others know where you are. There is one lake that we tie the flag off to a platform. There is a rope course below and dragging a flag through there is more hassle than it's worth when we are guaranteed to be deeper than 30ft. However, we carry our surface markers and spools in case we need to ascend from a different location.

 

[GrumpyOldGuy]

In certain sites, where I must have a flag but don't want to drag it around, I just use a spare weight (5lbs) on a bolt snap. If you are going to do this, make sure you have a SMB in case you have to surface away from the flag.

 

[imwright1985]

for marking a wreck were diving i take a loop of rope pass it under a rail or through a cleat and clip my reel off on that with the flag, takes literally a second to undo, for OW drift you gotta drag the flag, and for an anchor dive its on the boat

 

[drdaddy]

When jetty diving, we throw it in by the finger that we will be diving around - sometimes we might even drag it out a ways and drop down the very lightweight anchor. This lets the jetty fishermen, and hopefully the sportboaters, that we are diving around this finger of the jetty.

This is in Oregon where we are not required to have a flag, but it's a good idea. However, when jetty diving, you really can't drag it around as the surge would pull it in and around the rocks and hang you up/be dangerous.

 

[Deep South Divers]

We secure ours to the walls of our shop. There's a couple on the ceiling, too. Both of them are secured with thumbtacks.

When diving, we have found that displaying a dive flag attracts a lot of unwanted attention. More people are curious or interested in using the flag as a ski bouy - many of them have no idea it's illegal to be within 50 feet of the buoy in most places. Those who realize it's a "diver down" flag will often tie up to it in order to see the divers when they come out of the water. Diving, is, after all, viewed by the general public as a very cool and unusual sport!

Granted, in some places, having a dive flag is a legal obligation - but that's really a rare instance. Check your local laws regarding dive flags - many people believe that they're a legal requirement when they actually aren't.

I also encourage everyone to adopt the philosophy to be responsible for what you do and say. That is, if you don't want to get hit by a boat, take actions to not get hit by a boat - e.g. don't be in the path of an oncoming boat, and/or stay at depth until you know for sure it's safe to surface. Another method of being responsible for your own tail is to always ascend and descend on your anchor line so that you always surface in the relative safety of the shadow of your own boat.

To me, a diver toting a dive flag - unless legally required to do so - shows a bit of sidestepping their own obligation of personal responsibility - instead, they expect others to avoid any kind of catastrophe FOR them. I find the mindset a bit unsettling and indicative of other issues.

Dive flags also give away our best dive sites... No thanks.

 

[SkimFisher]

We secure ours to the walls of our shop. There's a couple on the ceiling, too. Both of them are secured with thumbtacks.

When diving, we have found that displaying a dive flag attracts a lot of unwanted attention. More people are curious or interested in using the flag as a ski bouy - many of them have no idea it's illegal to be within 50 feet of the buoy in most places. Those who realize it's a "diver down" flag will often tie up to it in order to see the divers when they come out of the water. Diving, is, after all, viewed by the general public as a very cool and unusual sport!

Granted, in some places, having a dive flag is a legal obligation - but that's really a rare instance. Check your local laws regarding dive flags - many people believe that they're a legal requirement when they actually aren't.

I also encourage everyone to adopt the philosophy to be responsible for what you do and say. That is, if you don't want to get hit by a boat, take actions to not get hit by a boat - e.g. don't be in the path of an oncoming boat, and/or stay at depth until you know for sure it's safe to surface. Another method of being responsible for your own tail is to always ascend and descend on your anchor line so that you always surface in the relative safety of the shadow of your own boat.

To me, a diver toting a dive flag - unless legally required to do so - shows a bit of sidestepping their own obligation of personal responsibility - instead, they expect others to avoid any kind of catastrophe FOR them. I find the mindset a bit unsettling and indicative of other issues.

Dive flags also give away our best dive sites... No thanks.

What happens in bad viz? Do I just feel around for the hull? I've personally dived in a few spots where boat engines cannot always be heard over the ambient noise until they are right on you. Hoods don't help with that either.

Not all diving situations facilitate that type of approach. What happens if you or another diver MUST get to the surface? There's no time to follow the bottom or come up another structure or take your time.

I do agree with a few points - just because I use a flag I don't trust it to keep me safe - a diver always needs to be thinking. But I find it's better to be safe than sorry. Lets also stop to consider the insurance liability of not towing a flag - you are immediately at fault. The day you get hit by a boat and you're not towing a flag you had better hope it kills you because you won't want to deal with the aftermath. (not you personally, I'm just speaking figuratively)

I don't do much shore diving, but when we boat dive in high-traffic areas we have the boat follow us with the flag displayed - this does two things: it alleviates the need for us tow a flag, and it also leaves someone topside to give hell to anyone that comes within 100 feet and an education on Florida dive flag laws. If we are staying in one area, then we stay near the boat but there is ALWAYS someone topside.

PS - where I live a dive flag is required by law.

 

[SkimFisher]

...and to answer the OP's question: If ever I do have to tow a flag I use my cavern/safety reel.

 

[Deep South Divers]

What happens in bad viz? Do I just feel around for the hull? I've personally dived in a few spots where boat engines cannot always be heard over the ambient noise until they are right on you. Hoods don't help with that either.

Not all diving situations facilitate that type of approach. What happens if you or another diver MUST get to the surface? There's no time to follow the bottom or come up another structure or take your time.

What happens if YOU or another diver MUST get to the surface? Do you trust everyone else in the river (who probably is past their legal limit in alcohol consumption and watching the children play in the stern of their speeding boat) to avoid you?

Why do you feel that it's somehow someone else's responsibility to keep you safe?

But I find it's better to be safe than sorry.

I agree, which is why I believe that a proactive stance on keeping your body out of the oncoming propeller is a better approach than flying a dive flag and assuming that someone else is going to do it for you.

Lets also stop to consider the insurance liability of not towing a flag - you are immediately at fault. The day you get hit by a boat and you're not towing a flag you had better hope it kills you because you won't want to deal with the aftermath. (not you personally, I'm just speaking figuratively)

You know, I may seem out of line on this one, but when I'm underwater and diving, "insurance liability" is the last thing on my mind.

With regards to the laws, any time a motor vehicle hits a pedestrian, whether it's on the street or in the water, the law assumes that it is the motor vehicle operator's fault. Insurance liability follows the law.

...But that's not the point. If I walk out into the street and am hit by a car and paralyzed for life, does it really matter whose fault it was?

As such, I generally don't walk down the middle of the road... Or park my truck on train tracks. Or surface in front of a speeding boat.

Whatever steps I need to take to accomplish that, I do. It's pretty simple.

I don't do much shore diving, but when we boat dive in high-traffic areas we have the boat follow us with the flag displayed

Really? Well, when I walk in high traffic highways, I generally have the car follow me while displaying a sign that has a symbol, "Pedestrian Walking." I expect everyone else to not hit me, for I am very concerned about insurance liability.

C'mon, man... What are you doing diving in high-traffic areas in the first place? Is there a lack of open water where you are?

PS - where I live a dive flag is required by law.

Well, then, I guess you've got to dive with a flag or face being fined. Personally, I wouldn't concern myself with the dive police, but if you really can get a ticket for not flying a dive flag, then I guess you'll have to fly a dive flag.

...Or dive somewhere else.

 

[SkimFisher]

What happens if YOU or another diver MUST get to the surface? Do you trust everyone else in the river (who probably is past their legal limit in alcohol consumption and watching the children play in the stern of their speeding boat) to avoid you?

Why do you feel that it's somehow someone else's responsibility to keep you safe?

I've found that the commonly practiced methods work pretty well for not just me, but the other few hundred/thousand diver's in the area. And where did I say that it's someone else's responsibility to keep me safe?

What I can't stand about the old "Do you use a flag or not" argument is that most often the guys that say "oh, it's just a magnet for boats, no one knows what it means, etc, etc" have usually had ONE bad experience where a boater rolled up on their flag. They usually have ONE picture of a boater doing something stupid around a flag. And then they use this ONE experience to make an over-dramatic generalization and then pass this on as defense for NOT using a flag to new and inexperienced divers. If YOU don't want to use a flag - then don't use a flag. At the end of the day it's all on you if you get hit.

Nothing is fool proof - I'm not disagreeing there. But it just seems to be an unnecessary risk. What is the harm in towing or setting a flag?

You know, I may seem out of line on this one, but when I'm underwater and diving, "insurance liability" is the last thing on my mind.

Nor I. That's why I take the necessary precautions BEFORE I get in the water.

With regards to the laws, any time a motor vehicle hits a pedestrian, whether it's on the street or in the water, the law assumes that it is the motor vehicle operator's fault. Insurance liability follows the law.

No, it doesn't. I've been in the situation first hand and I can tell you that it absolutely does not. You can't stop a pedestrian from jumping out in front of your car.

...But that's not the point. If I walk out into the street and am hit by a car and paralyzed for life, does it really matter whose fault it was?

As such, I generally don't walk down the middle of the road... Or park my truck on train tracks. Or surface in front of a speeding boat.

Whatever steps I need to take to accomplish that, I do. It's pretty simple.

...and people that do get hit by boats are doing it intentionally? Accidents happen. Even to those who think they are taking the necessary steps to avoid them. That's the chance we all take.

Really? Well, when I walk in high traffic highways, I generally have the car follow me while displaying a sign that has a symbol, "Pedestrian Walking." I expect everyone else to not hit me, for I am very concerned about insurance liability.

C'mon, man... What are you doing diving in high-traffic areas in the first place? Is there a lack of open water where you are?

When you're looking for critters you go where the critters are. That means bridges when it's too rough offshore. It's a common practice and it works quite well actually. But I appreciate the condescension.