Hose length for Rec only diver

[GDI]

I have, so far, never penetrated a wreck but plan to do so next week on the Zenobia in Cyprus.

Enjoy the Zenobia, its a big wreck for a ferry, not that far from shore either

 

[Lorenzoid]

. . .
Don't mean to hijack the thread but I am not aware of the agencies imposing any such limitations.

I interpreted halocline's comment as referring to the fact it is not taught in the vast majority of OW courses (even though the agencies may not prohibit teaching it). Instructors don't teach that way because they weren't taught that way. Perhaps things are slowly changing.

 

[GDI]

BSAC to name one

Talking about this are we then?: Clarification statement on Alternative Supply training and going diving - British Sub-Aqua Club

Interesting Read

---------- Post added October 21st, 2014 at 01:16 PM ----------

I interpreted halocline's comment as referring to the fact it is not taught in the vast majority of OW courses (even though the agencies may not prohibit teaching it). Instructors don't teach that way because they weren't taught that way. Perhaps things are slowly changing.

Fair enough, I take the approach of giving the student a big tool box to draw from. BUT also that they need to practice their configuration especially when they dive with someone new, due to a change in configuration OR are using new equipment. Skills poorly practiced go out the door real fast when needed.

The basic Octo config has the OOA diver simply grab the octo and secure a breathing source, I agree this is the standard most commonly used, and there is nothing wrong with it, it works. The Long Hose/bungie or alternate-inflator config basically requires similar deployment methodology and also works. If practiced

For the potential "Panicky Diver" the long hose or alternate-inflator has some risk to the donor diver as well BUT then so does the secured (or worst yet dragging) octo if the OOA Diver reaches for the in- mouth second stage of the donor diver, who may not be prepared nor in control should this happen. Lets face it, ingesting water when one was expecting air sucks! Thus both divers could now be at risk.

 

[JohnN]

Talking about this are we then?: Clarification statement on Alternative Supply training and going diving - British Sub-Aqua Club

Am I missing something ?

It is important that instructors teach to the current syllabus only and, where instructors have personal preferences for other techniques, they should not introduce them into the BSAC Diver Training syllabus without written approval of the BSAC National Diving Officer.

and

f. Under no circumstances whatsoever does the above infer BSAC accepts the introduction of techniques by individual divers that differ from those prescribed by the main training agencies. For example NDC is aware that ‘Primary Take’ methods are being promoted by some BSAC divers and instructors within BSAC Clubs, this is unacceptable to BSAC

 

[GDI]

Am I missing something ?

Nope I don't think you did, BSAC states their position, Based On your post I found the article, read it and I Leaned something new. To divert from their (BSAC) syllabus requires written approval. The other (main) agencies introduction of techniques is understood - While "Primary Take" is Unacceptable to BSAC.

Thus the Long Hose is by their understanding and definition, "Primary Take". I would also have to include the alternate-inflator config in this definition as well being that of a "Primary Take" technique by its method of deployment.

Interestingly so I do not disagree with their approach but I do not agree with it fully either.

 

[KenGordon]

Nope I don't think you did, BSAC states their position, Based On your post I found the article, read it and I Leaned something new. To divert from their (BSAC) syllabus requires written approval. The other (main) agencies introduction of techniques is understood - While "Primary Take" is Unacceptable to BSAC.

Thus the Long Hose is by their understanding and definition, "Primary Take". I would also have to include the alternate-inflator config in this definition as well being that of a "Primary Take" technique by its method of deployment.

Interestingly so I do not disagree with their approach but I do not agree with it fully either.

The BSAC training position is not about the long hose, it is about the "hog loop" way of wearing it. You can train (with BSAC) with a bungeed or stuffed long hose but not a hog loop. You can dive a hog loop as long as you have been trained (obviously not by BSAC).

The primary take business is something else. Do any agencies suggest that should be done?

 

[JohnN]

the bsac training position is not about the long hose, it is about the "hog loop" way of wearing it. You can train (with bsac) with a bungeed or stuffed long hose but not a hog loop. You can dive a hog loop as long as you have been trained (obviously not by bsac).

The primary take business is something else. Do any agencies suggest that should be done?

gue :d

OMG I've never been "trained" to use a long hose/bungee backup. I'm gonna die. . .

 

[KenGordon]

gue :d

OMG I've never been "trained" to use a long hose/bungee backup. I'm gonna die. . .

What is that S drill about then? Preparing to have the regulator taken from your mouth or donating it to the out of gas diver?

I don't defend the Bsac position on your life expectancy.

 

[JohnN]

What is that S drill about then? Preparing to have the regulator taken from your mouth or donating it to the out of gas diver?

I don't defend the Bsac position on your life expectancy.

One of the beauties of the bungeed backup is I never have to look far to find it.

I took Fundies and decided GUE was not for me (I was diving a long hose before then). I don't believe for a second that a panicked diver is going to do that silly hand across the throat thing (btw I have a yellow/green cover on my primary reg) I don't have to worry about where my backup might have gotten to.

In a similar vein, I have stumbled getting out of a surf line without my primary in my mouth. Having that secondary right there under my chin seemed like an extraordinarily good idea at the time

 

[KenGordon]

One of the beauties of the bungeed backup is I never have to look far to find it.

I took Fundies and decided GUE was not for me (I was diving a long hose before then). I don't believe for a second that a panicked diver is going to do that silly hand across the throat thing (btw I have a yellow/green cover on my primary reg) I don't have to worry about where my backup might have gotten to.

In a similar vein, I have stumbled getting out of a surf line without my primary in my mouth. Having that secondary right there under my chin seemed like an extraordinarily good idea at the time

Sorry, we are talking at cross purposes about 'bungeed'. The BSAC long hose way is to have bungee on the tank and that holds the spare hose. Kind of like a regulator stored on a stage. Another popular way is to use the sleeve that might have held a BC inflation cylinder. That is entirely unrelated to using bungee to make a necklace to keep a second stage in place. We'll sort of, if you don't put your regs on in the right order with hog looping the necklace can get tangled.