Dear Rob,
Here’s the problem with your position. First, you responded to second-hand post made by another member of the board that reposted something I wrote somewhere else. You’ve made judgments about my dive procedures without bothering to ask or find out any details about what I’m doing. You’ve restated dogma. Your position is entirely hypocritical since in other forums you openly admit not following the rules yourself.
You openly admit solo diving, making visual jumps, and the fact that sometimes you don’t run a primary line from open water into the cavern to the main line of the cave. Here are the quotes from posts you recently made:
“ Close to the last dozen new caves (to me) have been solo. And almost all off the virgin passage I've been in has been solo”
“I found myself doing some simple visual jumps early in my cave diving. Nothing major, the most common was Double Lines passage in JB - visual to and from it. For those unfamiliar with it, it's a short bypass of the mainline. I'd take it on the way in and take the gold line on the way out. Then I started doing some other visuals in more demanding areas but again all circuit type stuff.”
“As for JB, I've done several hundred dives there. I dive that cave at least once a week. If I were ever to exit and find visibility completely gone I would deploy a safety to exit. I've practiced this to ensure I could get out. I don't deny this, even to my students. Yes, I'm taking a risk but it's a very calculated and thought out risk.”
My only point here is that you don’t always follow the rules as they are taught by the certification agencies-and you are an instructor.
Secondly, in another forum titled, ”Thanks to Ginnie Springs for recovering my stolen Deco bottle”, Jim Wyatt describes the loss and return of his deco bottle from the cavern zone at Ginnie. I found the posts in this section ironic, given your position here in this forum since there seems to be a problem with OW divers taking deco cylinders at Ginnie and perhaps, Little River. What I found most interesting was that no one suggested taking the bottle with them and carrying the bottle throughout the dive. Several divers suggested hiding their bottles-no one ever mentioned tying their bottle to the main line. In one case, a diver commented about hiding the bottle and in your response you joked about that. I noticed the entire absence of any sort of mention that this might not be a good idea since if the cave gets silted out, they might not be able to find their deco gas. You didn’t mention this to them…
You can’t have it both ways, Rob. Or at least, I’m not going to allow you to talk to me like I’m some sort of idiot and get away with it.
Lake Pleasant covers 10,000 acres and is 260 feet deep. If I choose to run lines, and create dives that have never been done before, that is my business. If I choose to dive those lines, holding to the highest cave training standards including the risks associated with those standards-it’s my business. This includes doing proper jumps at junctions, running a primary to my main line, tying off my stage cylinders and deco bottles-holding exactly to my training-that’s my business. If I’ve done all this so I can come to cave country and have a seamless transition to the real thing that is reason enough for all my trouble. And now, since the OW season is in full swing I have to deal with the possibility of losing cylinders-how I deal with that is my business. My risks are just as “calculated” and “thought out” as yours.
Peter Delannoy
Here’s the problem with your position. First, you responded to second-hand post made by another member of the board that reposted something I wrote somewhere else. You’ve made judgments about my dive procedures without bothering to ask or find out any details about what I’m doing. You’ve restated dogma. Your position is entirely hypocritical since in other forums you openly admit not following the rules yourself.
You openly admit solo diving, making visual jumps, and the fact that sometimes you don’t run a primary line from open water into the cavern to the main line of the cave. Here are the quotes from posts you recently made:
“ Close to the last dozen new caves (to me) have been solo. And almost all off the virgin passage I've been in has been solo”
“I found myself doing some simple visual jumps early in my cave diving. Nothing major, the most common was Double Lines passage in JB - visual to and from it. For those unfamiliar with it, it's a short bypass of the mainline. I'd take it on the way in and take the gold line on the way out. Then I started doing some other visuals in more demanding areas but again all circuit type stuff.”
“As for JB, I've done several hundred dives there. I dive that cave at least once a week. If I were ever to exit and find visibility completely gone I would deploy a safety to exit. I've practiced this to ensure I could get out. I don't deny this, even to my students. Yes, I'm taking a risk but it's a very calculated and thought out risk.”
My only point here is that you don’t always follow the rules as they are taught by the certification agencies-and you are an instructor.
Secondly, in another forum titled, ”Thanks to Ginnie Springs for recovering my stolen Deco bottle”, Jim Wyatt describes the loss and return of his deco bottle from the cavern zone at Ginnie. I found the posts in this section ironic, given your position here in this forum since there seems to be a problem with OW divers taking deco cylinders at Ginnie and perhaps, Little River. What I found most interesting was that no one suggested taking the bottle with them and carrying the bottle throughout the dive. Several divers suggested hiding their bottles-no one ever mentioned tying their bottle to the main line. In one case, a diver commented about hiding the bottle and in your response you joked about that. I noticed the entire absence of any sort of mention that this might not be a good idea since if the cave gets silted out, they might not be able to find their deco gas. You didn’t mention this to them…
You can’t have it both ways, Rob. Or at least, I’m not going to allow you to talk to me like I’m some sort of idiot and get away with it.
Lake Pleasant covers 10,000 acres and is 260 feet deep. If I choose to run lines, and create dives that have never been done before, that is my business. If I choose to dive those lines, holding to the highest cave training standards including the risks associated with those standards-it’s my business. This includes doing proper jumps at junctions, running a primary to my main line, tying off my stage cylinders and deco bottles-holding exactly to my training-that’s my business. If I’ve done all this so I can come to cave country and have a seamless transition to the real thing that is reason enough for all my trouble. And now, since the OW season is in full swing I have to deal with the possibility of losing cylinders-how I deal with that is my business. My risks are just as “calculated” and “thought out” as yours.
Peter Delannoy
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