Hello to all! - new solo diver

[drbill]

Redundant air sources don't save lives.

Not sure why you'd make that statement. They obviously can and do save lives. However, if what you mean is that a redundant air supply alone may not be enough to save a life, I'd agree with that.

 

[tye1138]

Not sure why you'd make that statement. They obviously can and do save lives. However, if what you mean is that a redundant air supply alone may not be enough to save a life, I'd agree with that.

Yes, with technical diving, spare bottles can mean the difference between life and
death. Especially in overhead, non-accessible environments where dive plans can change in a heartbeat.

Here is my beef with pony bottles in recreational diving.

The industry has set guidelines which states, our buddy is our crutch. If you don't want a buddy, then buy a pony bottle because all your buddy is worth is their air supply anyway, right? The industry puts too much emphasis on OOA situations and not enough emphasis on being a good diver. In fact, an experienced and educated diver will never think twice about OOA situations because everything is under control even in life-threatening situations.

The issue isn't how much gas you take down with you, or how much redundancy you have due to potential regulator failure. The issue is the world is full of poor divers, who suck down air, who never look at their gauges and get themselves into some serious trouble. Be a smart diver, with proper trim, excellent consumption and smarts, and you will be a survivor.

 

[ozzydamo]

Yes, with technical diving, spare bottles can mean the difference between life and
death. Especially in overhead, non-accessible environments where dive plans can change in a heartbeat.

Here is my beef with pony bottles in recreational diving.

The industry has set guidelines which states, our buddy is our crutch. If you don't want a buddy, then buy a pony bottle because all your buddy is worth is their air supply anyway, right? The industry puts too much emphasis on OOA situations and not enough emphasis on being a good diver. In fact, an experienced and educated diver will never think twice about OOA situations because everything is under control even in life-threatening situations.

The issue isn't how much gas you take down with you, or how much redundancy you have due to potential regulator failure. The issue is the world is full of poor divers, who suck down air, who never look at their gauges and get themselves into some serious trouble. Be a smart diver, with proper trim, excellent consumption and smarts, and you will be a survivor.

I get what you are talking about.

Shallow water diving- a pony might just be an unnecessary burden. Surfacing would be quicker and easier.

The holiday season divers and their lack of aquanautical ability/watermanship and lack of fitness is the real worry. Also starting young and skindiving firstly, getting muscle memory in dive movements while it's so easy and natural to learn(when your young).


Using top quality, properly and regularly serviced and most importantly LOOKED AFTER regs, hoses, tanks, inflators, pc and hp gauges- including the tank O-rings. This the difference between someone that has redundancy for a failure and the person that will never have a failure, who's plan b- is to simply do a safe assent, skipping the safety stop.

Preparation is what makes someone "lucky". Having looked at some of the rigs some people dive, I can understand the reason behind a pony bottle - open up their reg. and show them the mould and slime growing on the diaphragm- from poor clean up and stowing it wet and unventilated.

I don't dive a pony for warm water, less then 15m deep dives- which tends to be nearly all my dives nowadays- and then most of the dives I do deeper then that seem to have buddies, so my pony hasn't seen a refill except of practicing and annual inspections.

I really believe that side mount is the better way to go anyhow, especially the latest rigs getting around today.

 

[Basking Ridge Diver]

Yes, with technical diving, spare bottles can mean the difference between life and
death. Especially in overhead, non-accessible environments where dive plans can change in a heartbeat.

Here is my beef with pony bottles in recreational diving.

The industry has set guidelines which states, our buddy is our crutch. If you don't want a buddy, then buy a pony bottle because all your buddy is worth is their air supply anyway, right? The industry puts too much emphasis on OOA situations and not enough emphasis on being a good diver. In fact, an experienced and educated diver will never think twice about OOA situations because everything is under control even in life-threatening situations.

The issue isn't how much gas you take down with you, or how much redundancy you have due to potential regulator failure. The issue is the world is full of poor divers, who suck down air, who never look at their gauges and get themselves into some serious trouble. Be a smart diver, with proper trim, excellent consumption and smarts, and you will be a survivor.

I won't get into this too much but you do realize this is a Solo Divers forum? That said the forum falls under? Yep you guessed it Technical Diving Specialties... If this was the Basic Scuba Discussion section I may buy into what you said - but I think you need to understand that in this section most of us have enough dives or have taken the class.

It does not appear that you are a technical diver from this "where dive plans can change in a heartbeat" - what happened to Plan your Dive and Dive your Plan?? So your rational is because it is more dangerous and I can change my plan on a technical dive in a moments notice then I can carry a pony? Your logic seems flawed to me. If any place a plan is most important it is in an overhead technical environment and for me on a solo dive... I like my chances with my pony.

 

[Bob DBF]

The issue isn't how much gas you take down with you, or how much redundancy you have due to potential regulator failure. The issue is the world is full of poor divers, who suck down air, who never look at their gauges and get themselves into some serious trouble. Be a smart diver, with proper trim, excellent consumption and smarts, and you will be a survivor.

There are a lot of good reasons to become a solo diver, but I am not of the opinion that ones view of others skills should be the reason.

The actual issue is that you have decided, on your own, what subsets divers are divided into and on which side you stand. Although the thread centers around cave diving, it's lesson is more about what can go wrong with self evaluation and ego. http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/accidents-incidents/472730-deaths-eagles-nest-homosassa-fl.html

Personally, I have found that divers are quite a diverse group of people with a variety of skills, I like diving with them. I dive solo because I like having time to myself, I also hike solo, and so on..... It's only a choice, not a solution to all of diving's issues.



Bob
--------------------------------
The most important thing to plan when solo diving is to make sure that you are not diving with an idiot. Dsix36

 

[dive_more]

I appreciate all the comments !
for me a pony bottle is a very good "buddy" in case a have a 1 stage failure, I have a alternate air source, because all my dives are around 100 feet, or better said, i like diving "deep" making an emergency ascend can be not an good idea -in solo, and buddy diving-
here is a nice video from Mark Powell about why divers make stupid things, and about the swiss cheese example it's just to add more security.


[video=youtube;gXF1U1h_Sb8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXF1U1h_Sb8[/video]
I avoid stress, i know how to calm down because i know if i dont, i will only consume precious air, and things want go better.

 

[tye1138]

So your rational is because it is more dangerous and I can change my plan on a technical dive in a moments notice then I can carry a pony?

Nope, my rational is that things have a greater chance to go wrong in technical environments, rather then someone swimming along at a recreational level. Recreational divers, staying away from; deep, dark, overhead environments, really shouldn't have any need to carry extra bottles. That is my only point… no more, no less.

 

[dive_more]

Dear dive_more
If you are lucky enough to have a girlfriend that scuba - why would you ever want to go solo?
On the serious side - even if you are not going solo soon the process to become a self sufficient diver is always a good thing so add that pony asap.
I am just worried about the "small pony" bit that you mentioned.
I dive with a 15liter cylinder which is pretty heavy allready but I would not dream of using anything less than a 3 liter pony even for shallow shore dives.
It was an eye opener for me to see the pressure drop when I simulated an out of air situation below 10 meters.

Hi i dido not see your reply
Small pony is for me less than 7.5 liters (the "Standart" pony size) i am looking for an 3 liter
my girlfriend dives but not as many as i want
(my 15L is heavy.... but it contains many air, diving deep, more than an hour and respecting thirds thats why i love it)

tye1138
Recreational diving you can go down to more than 130 feet (!) i think you have an "virtual"overhead here, so you can't ascend to surface in less than 3 minutes, no?

I want to take some day in the week and disconnect to dive, another point is that a like to make underwater video.

 

[sportxlh]

...... Recreational divers, staying away from; deep, dark, overhead environments, really shouldn't have any need to carry extra bottles......

tye1138: you obviously are more experienced than me, but I'm not sure I completely agree. Most of my solo'ing is in fairly warm water with good vis and never with an overhead environment, but is at 75-100 feet, nearly always as drift dives and with a single cylinder. I keep my equipment well maintained but if I really had a total failure at 100 feet, I'd want that 19cf pony I carry. That's just my thought: I'm uber conservative and also carry a mask in a pocket and a extra lift bag when I'm solo.

 

[tye1138]

When I think of recreational diving, I picture a walk into the ocean from shore OR a beginner boat dive in some shallow areas with excellent visibility, warm water and plenty of other divers to bump into.

I know the industry considers 130ft the limit of recreational diving, but I've never thought it was a smart idea. Nitrogen loading can really effect mental acuity and thats the last thing a solo diver needs. So just because the book says its OK, doesn't mean it really is. In my view, an alternative bottom gas is required for consistently diving at 100+ft anyway, so that means more "technical" training. You wouldn't catch me doing any dive off the back of a boat with a 100+ft floor, without nitrox, doubles, pony bottle, at least two lights, reel and some signaling devices.