Has anyone noticed?

[KrisB]

Gotta say I have loved my "pocket" flag - the big "hassle" of a dive flag for me is it's one more thing to carry down to the water, which can be a lot when you're carrying a camera, scooter and stage bottle. Now I just kick out, then when ready for descent I inflate my flag, once descent is complete I pull it down, deflate and stow it in my pocket (can't tow a flag while scootering efficiently) and at the end of the dive I deploy it from depth, and once I'm back near the shore just deflate it and put it back in my pocket for a hands free exit.

Unless there is a law saying the flag must be "rigid" I'm ok - it's 12"x12"

I thought it said something about a stiffener to hold it out, but looking again, it doesn't.

You do, however, have to display it while you're diving -- so technically, if they see the flag pop to the surface as you're about to ascend, they could cite you:

§13-245-9(a) A "diver's flag" as defined by rule and measuring not less than twelve inches by twelve inches shall be required to be displayed on the surface of the water by any person or group of persons engaged in free diving or SCUBA diving.

(emphasis mine).

As I've mentioned here before (and I'll add to my "this might be a cash grab if...") -- technically, as soon as a snorkeller (who is not required to have a flag) does a surface dive, they're now a freediver and need to have a flag... and could be cited for not having one.

 

[Shaka Doug]

We always hear how the DLNR is underfunded and understaffed. I can't believe they're not writing flag tickets all day long. Talk about easy money! I saw at least five different groups either not use a flag or use their flag improperly just today. If it's about $100 a pop, that's pretty good dough. They could get some new uniforms or something. Maybe even pay for a sign at the beach educating divers and boaters about the flags, what they are for, and how to use one. I don't understand why I keep hearing from tourist divers that the shop didn't tell them the flag rule when they rented their tanks. That's more Easy Money for the shop owner.

I have seen flags save people and I've also seen the remains of two different people diving without the required flags who got CHOPPED UP by boat propellers (two separate incidents). I don't mind towing my flag around. It adds safety for me and my guests. I'm convinced on that.

If you care not to dive with a flag, but recognize it's for your own safety, come out with me, I'll pull it for you so you won't need to worry about it. I'll take good care of you too. That's what I do!

 

[k8brandt]

D... so I made the 4 block drive home and got it ...

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Rub it in....

I will have to remember the tip about entering on the sand at high tide next time we get to Maui. Mala Wharf was a great dive, I just hated that swim across the channel. I am NOT a swimmer, yet I dive. My family still can't believe it.

This next HI trip in Sept is the Big Island, we haven't been there yet. The dive flag is on the checklist.

 

[aascubagirl]

Kauai dive sites are seeing many more visits from the DLNR as well...everyone has been receiving stern warnings thus far, no citations that I am aware of but I am sure that will change soon.

 

[1fmauichef]

I have seen flags save people and I've also seen the remains of two different people diving without the required flags who got CHOPPED UP by boat propellers (two separate incidents).

Shaka Doug- Thats rough!!! It's a bummer to hear things like that....

I regularly dive Airport which it not a heavily boated area in comparison to Mala & Makenna. I see a lot of tourists going out with OUT dive flags, & maybe just for that particular reason. Not a lot of boats and multiple of other reasons.

Lets ask this question?-
Now that the word it starting to get out that the DLNR is making more frequent guest appearances, do ya think dive shops will start to make more of a "suggestive" up-sale to tourists to rent and bring along the dive flag more to avoid the $100 ticket as apposed to emphasizing their personal safety?? Hummmm.........

 

[Shaka Doug]

Shaka Doug- Thats rough!!! It's a bummer to hear things like that....

Yeah, I know. Harsh words. It was a gruesome sight and I will never be part of that scene if I can help it! Talk about 'Bummer' how would you like to be the victim, boat driver, or family member of either?? Not fun. Both accidents occured in St. Thomas, Virgin Islands back in the early 1990's. I still have the Daily News newspaper clipping with the photo of my old friend Peter holding the one guys brains together with a tee shirt. It was horrible and they actually put the picture on the front page!!! Got the message out quick!! Another close friend Mike retrieved a guy at Sapphire Beach who was hit the same way. SCUBA diving without a Diver Down Flag! He still has nightmares about that almost fifteen years later. It's pretty easy to prevent with just a little knowledge on both ends...the diver and the boat operator. I could never figure out why we just don't have signs in places where people boat and dive to educate people about the red/white stripe flag??? I have people ask me what it's for all the time.

Lets ask this question?-
Now that the word it starting to get out that the DLNR is making more frequent guest appearances, do ya think dive shops will start to make more of a "suggestive" up-sale to tourists to rent and bring along the dive flag more to avoid the $100 ticket as apposed to emphasizing their personal safety?? Hummmm.........

It would be a sound business move to do that. And if the tourists didn't want to deal with the flag, maybe they would be more likely to take a guided tour instead and let a pro handle the flag.

 

[Opule]

btw - I no longer enter mala from the "sand" area that makes you cross the boat channel - I've found going out over the reef (especially at high tide) to be quite easy - today we were able to scooter from shore all the way out without walking over the reef at all.

Could you elaborate on this? I once tried entering on the south side and floating over the reef, and a year later still shudder to remember the belly scraping that ensued. Is there a particular entry point that makes this easy?

 

[KrisB]

I regularly dive Airport which it not a heavily boated area in comparison to Mala & Makenna. I see a lot of tourists going out with OUT dive flags, & maybe just for that particular reason. Not a lot of boats and multiple of other reasons.

Airport is a nice, easy dive and relatively foolproof as long as there isn't a strong current or big surf. I suspect that's why tourists dive there lots -- not to mention the fact that a lot of them were likely certified there!

As for the no-flag thing -- many don't see the safety risk, and like speeding, are willing to take the risk of the ticket for not having to deal with the hassle of the flag.

Now that the word it starting to get out that the DLNR is making more frequent guest appearances, do ya think dive shops will start to make more of a "suggestive" up-sale to tourists to rent and bring along the dive flag more to avoid the $100 ticket as apposed to emphasizing their personal safety??

Most dive shops I've been in have been doing that for years -- in fact, as part of the rental agreement, many are including a line about "I have been informed of the dive flag law in Hawaii and have either rented a flag or will provide my own." or something like that.

Could you elaborate on this? I once tried entering on the south side and floating over the reef, and a year later still shudder to remember the belly scraping that ensued. Is there a particular entry point that makes this easy?

Yeah... slack high tide.

Either that or try to stay closer to the old pier -- it seems there's a bit of a deeper path over there.

 

[kidspot]

yup - stay close to the pier, it's deeper there, and if you go at high tide it's deep enough to swim the whole way out. At low tide I still walk out till I get to water deep enough to get my fins on it and then swim. The live parts of the reef are very easy to see and avoid ... most of it is now dead reef from the surf and being trod upon.

If it helps, here is a video I took for a site review of Mala wharf http://www.alohashoredivers.com/sites/mala.wmv

 

[Cacia]

Divers need to be aware of props, and be ready to drop down, IMO. If a boat looks like it doesn't see you, I'd be ready to sink at an opportune time.

You can get all the flags you want, and at the end of the day, it is about defensive diving, whether we are dodging canoes, motorboats or keels. It is the keels that scare me.

Half the people out there (off Waikiki) don't even know what the flag means, so I don't bank on all those regulations, it is a bad plan.