Spectre
Contributor
Just tell him "If you didn't open the valve back on during your drill you'd end up dead because your air was off."
Garbage that you get for being DIR, or semi-DIR
- Thread starter WillAbbott
- Start date
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Just tell him "If you didn't open the valve back on during your drill you'd end up dead because your air was off."
bwerb
Hoser/English Translator, eh
If you are a little more Star Wars you could use: "I've gone over to the dark side"
or alternately if you are more Star Trek inclined: "Resistance is futile, I've been assimilated."
or alternately if you are more Star Trek inclined: "Resistance is futile, I've been assimilated."
OP
WillAbbott
Guest
LOL, I'm more star wars...
Thanks all for the replies... I think I really just needed to get it off my chest more than anything, I just finished an e-mail back to my bud, and basically explained the skill very little more, explained why I've gone with the config I have, and ended by I accept that you might not approve of my gear...maybe we should just agree to dissagree on this subject... also explained a little of the background of the system, as being a time proven config and all... etc.
I like your last post there Mo2vation... very nice... Though I'm not up to the standards you mention, nor is this buddy at the low end standards... we both fall somewhere in the middle, with me JUST starting to practice horizontal ascents... and been doing horizontal descents for sometime now...
The cost thing is very good point... THOUGH to be honest I have 2 pairs of fins, both of which I want to ditch, I don't have the UBER Jet type fins yet
I have Aeris Velocities (which work ok with the types of kicks) and Tusa X-Pert Zooms, the Aeris were my first fins, and the Tusa's were well, a solution to a problem (not knowing any kics besides dolphin, and flutter, and flutter being so crappy with air consumption, and my legs) prior to my decision to "come to the darkside" even partially... so I still dive the splits mostly, though I'm starting to use the aeris more since I can do modified frogs and reverse with them... though being the moron I am 
I did a surface swim with them doing flutter, and about killed myself, just learned I should do modified frog with them even at the surface...DOH!
But I KNOW my BC (BP/Wings) cost less...
Hmm Cost comparisson analysis...
Halcyon 36# Pioneer wing, BP, Harness (the Cadilac shall we say of BP/wings, or even the BMW, Porche, whtever)
Vs.
My buddies SeaQUest Black Diamond...
My BC, totaled at $555.00... His well, I'm sure over $600, probalby closer to 700-800 (thoose things are SPENDY)
Regs, not a clue how much his cost...
Dive lights (heres where the logic could fail, canister lights are by far spendier, however that much equally more are they better)
I have a $70 C8 to hold me until I have everything else, at which time it will go bye bye for a canister (LONG future)
He uses a $250 Light Cannon, which was beautiful on a night dive, but to be honest IMO SUCKS durring the day, you can't hardly see the beam unless shinning in a hole (unlike a canister, or my light even)
On some of the stuff yeah it's less expensive, but better by far... Speaking of which, he said something about breaking the backpack in his BC...hmm surpise, platick backplate type thing, broke, SS backplate, likely to break (not very), something to do with the plate and/or right wing, not sure if it was 2 seperate occasions/breakages, or one.
Anyways... I'm SO gratefull to all you guys for the support, and advice, esspecially in opening my eyes to DIR (though you didn't do it by yourselves, other people/sites did, as well as me finnaly realizing one of the core foundations of DIR was something I belived all along on an unrelated activity) I belive for a different sport/activity that you should always do skills the same way every time, regardless... so it only made perfect sence my diving should be the same (this is what finnaly pushed me to the darkside) having the realization that was one of the core foundations of DIR, and that having a DIR type rig meant having all my stuff the same regardless of what diving I'm doing, except for minor changes such as doubles/singles an OOA situation is the same at 10' as 300' as with a wreck or cave... that and the fact I already decided I liked the BC, so why not try out the other stuff, so many people saying all of it was good, including the BC (which I agreed with at that point) couldn't be too far off...
Will Out!
Thanks all for the replies... I think I really just needed to get it off my chest more than anything, I just finished an e-mail back to my bud, and basically explained the skill very little more, explained why I've gone with the config I have, and ended by I accept that you might not approve of my gear...maybe we should just agree to dissagree on this subject... also explained a little of the background of the system, as being a time proven config and all... etc.
I like your last post there Mo2vation... very nice... Though I'm not up to the standards you mention, nor is this buddy at the low end standards... we both fall somewhere in the middle, with me JUST starting to practice horizontal ascents... and been doing horizontal descents for sometime now...
The cost thing is very good point... THOUGH to be honest I have 2 pairs of fins, both of which I want to ditch, I don't have the UBER Jet type fins yet
I have Aeris Velocities (which work ok with the types of kicks) and Tusa X-Pert Zooms, the Aeris were my first fins, and the Tusa's were well, a solution to a problem (not knowing any kics besides dolphin, and flutter, and flutter being so crappy with air consumption, and my legs) prior to my decision to "come to the darkside" even partially... so I still dive the splits mostly, though I'm starting to use the aeris more since I can do modified frogs and reverse with them... though being the moron I am I did a surface swim with them doing flutter, and about killed myself, just learned I should do modified frog with them even at the surface...DOH!But I KNOW my BC (BP/Wings) cost less...
Hmm Cost comparisson analysis...
Halcyon 36# Pioneer wing, BP, Harness (the Cadilac shall we say of BP/wings, or even the BMW, Porche, whtever)
Vs.
My buddies SeaQUest Black Diamond...
My BC, totaled at $555.00... His well, I'm sure over $600, probalby closer to 700-800 (thoose things are SPENDY)
Regs, not a clue how much his cost...
Dive lights (heres where the logic could fail, canister lights are by far spendier, however that much equally more are they better)
I have a $70 C8 to hold me until I have everything else, at which time it will go bye bye for a canister (LONG future)
He uses a $250 Light Cannon, which was beautiful on a night dive, but to be honest IMO SUCKS durring the day, you can't hardly see the beam unless shinning in a hole (unlike a canister, or my light even)
On some of the stuff yeah it's less expensive, but better by far... Speaking of which, he said something about breaking the backpack in his BC...hmm surpise, platick backplate type thing, broke, SS backplate, likely to break (not very), something to do with the plate and/or right wing, not sure if it was 2 seperate occasions/breakages, or one.
Anyways... I'm SO gratefull to all you guys for the support, and advice, esspecially in opening my eyes to DIR (though you didn't do it by yourselves, other people/sites did, as well as me finnaly realizing one of the core foundations of DIR was something I belived all along on an unrelated activity) I belive for a different sport/activity that you should always do skills the same way every time, regardless... so it only made perfect sence my diving should be the same (this is what finnaly pushed me to the darkside) having the realization that was one of the core foundations of DIR, and that having a DIR type rig meant having all my stuff the same regardless of what diving I'm doing, except for minor changes such as doubles/singles an OOA situation is the same at 10' as 300' as with a wreck or cave... that and the fact I already decided I liked the BC, so why not try out the other stuff, so many people saying all of it was good, including the BC (which I agreed with at that point) couldn't be too far off...
Will Out!
I don't give flak to people for the way they dive.
You can dive the way you want to...I'll dive the way that I want to. I like my gear configured in a few ways that could be taken as following one style of diving or another...but it's configured my way.
I wouldn't get too worked up about it. I mean for crying out loud...it's just scuba gear.
You can dive the way you want to...I'll dive the way that I want to. I like my gear configured in a few ways that could be taken as following one style of diving or another...but it's configured my way.
I wouldn't get too worked up about it. I mean for crying out loud...it's just scuba gear.
Ziggys_Friend
Guest
Overtime you might also run into what I've found happens ... we're "different" and that interests people. I'm new at all this - new to diving and new to DIR, but when Mot2vation and I hit Casino Point two weeks ago I noticed lots of people checking our gear out ... and it led to a number of nice conversations.
Attitude is everything. I believe in this stuff and post DIR-F I finally have a clue why ... but I'm not here to sell anybody else on it, just share what I believe in if they're interested.
For that matter, it was about four months ago that I was diving a traditional BC at Casino Point myself and ran into to guys diving DIR. Stuff looked ... different and so I asked, it was their answers and suggestions that I check GUE out that led me to DIR so I guess it's all coming full circle.
~<//><
Attitude is everything. I believe in this stuff and post DIR-F I finally have a clue why ... but I'm not here to sell anybody else on it, just share what I believe in if they're interested.
For that matter, it was about four months ago that I was diving a traditional BC at Casino Point myself and ran into to guys diving DIR. Stuff looked ... different and so I asked, it was their answers and suggestions that I check GUE out that led me to DIR so I guess it's all coming full circle.
~<//><
ElectricZombie
Contributor
98% of the people I dive with are not even remotely DIR...They are DIW to the extreme. I certainly get a bunch of weird looks and comments. If someone is really interested, I don't mind explaining about the setup/DIR system and will even make time to let them try it out if they like. I had one of my students do this and he owns a Halcyon Pioneer setup now. (His 1st BC actually)
I make it a point not to say anything too negative about a person's rig (Very hard considering the crap people show up to dive with) unless it is dangerous or the person wants to dive with me. As long as it does not seem unsafe and does not put people at risk, I don't really care.
On occasion I'll get some guy who thinks he's Professor SCUBA...and feels the need to demonstrate his "advanced knowledge" by attempting to argue with me. I try to be nice, but I usually just ignore them. Shooting down their arguments on a logical basis does not seem to register with these people...You make them look like an idiot and they come back for more...
Some people don't have a clue and never will.
Try to be nice and helpful (you might get someone interested) but, you don't have to put up with idiots.
I make it a point not to say anything too negative about a person's rig (Very hard considering the crap people show up to dive with) unless it is dangerous or the person wants to dive with me. As long as it does not seem unsafe and does not put people at risk, I don't really care.
On occasion I'll get some guy who thinks he's Professor SCUBA...and feels the need to demonstrate his "advanced knowledge" by attempting to argue with me. I try to be nice, but I usually just ignore them. Shooting down their arguments on a logical basis does not seem to register with these people...You make them look like an idiot and they come back for more...
Some people don't have a clue and never will.
Try to be nice and helpful (you might get someone interested) but, you don't have to put up with idiots.
Concentrate on the skills.
No one will give you a hard time after seeing you move like a gost throught the water with all your hoses flat against your body and not hardly moving your fins. After they see you begin an ascent by just arching your back a little (which they likely won't even catch) instead of going vertical and kicking like crazzy with your fins in the bottom like they do and after seeing you turn this way and that move back or foreward without flopping around then...they won't give you a hard time. Point being they need to see the skill then they will respect the rest.
No one will give you a hard time after seeing you move like a gost throught the water with all your hoses flat against your body and not hardly moving your fins. After they see you begin an ascent by just arching your back a little (which they likely won't even catch) instead of going vertical and kicking like crazzy with your fins in the bottom like they do and after seeing you turn this way and that move back or foreward without flopping around then...they won't give you a hard time. Point being they need to see the skill then they will respect the rest.
JimC
Contributor
When I first got my BP/Wing I started to drive my wife nuts. We had the standard rec setup at the time and I moved while she didn't.
Well, she got fed up with my pointing out how my rig was more efficent, cheaper, etc. She thretend to stop diveing with me if I didn't shut up.
Point taken and I shut up quick.
2 weeks later, with me saying nothing she wants to go to a pool and have a drill session. Next day her long hose was in the mail. while she still has the jacket, she is just about fed up with it and ready for a BP. She has her self come around to the point where she wants to improve her diveing abbilites.
She came there alone, and without my nudging. She wants to be a better diver.
Perhaps your driving your buddy to hard or your a bit to zelous.. I know I was. Now I just dive it. I don't try to explain it, or show it off.. infact I try to hide it untill the last minute.
I answer questions if asked, and I show new budies around the thing if I'm not diveing with my wife.. but other than that its just a pile of steel, rubber and cloth.
Well, she got fed up with my pointing out how my rig was more efficent, cheaper, etc. She thretend to stop diveing with me if I didn't shut up.
Point taken and I shut up quick.
2 weeks later, with me saying nothing she wants to go to a pool and have a drill session. Next day her long hose was in the mail. while she still has the jacket, she is just about fed up with it and ready for a BP. She has her self come around to the point where she wants to improve her diveing abbilites.
She came there alone, and without my nudging. She wants to be a better diver.
Perhaps your driving your buddy to hard or your a bit to zelous.. I know I was. Now I just dive it. I don't try to explain it, or show it off.. infact I try to hide it untill the last minute.
I answer questions if asked, and I show new budies around the thing if I'm not diveing with my wife.. but other than that its just a pile of steel, rubber and cloth.
DIR, multiple regs, doubles, backplates & long hoses aside, the valve manipulation drill can save your life. Every year - that is, each and every year without exception - there is at least one, usually two and occasionally three, fatalities where the diver either jumped in with the air shut off, negatively buoyant and unable to turn the air on, or where they have confused left and right and jumped in with the valve one quarter turn on rather than one quarter turn back from full on, had difficulty breathing at depth resulting in pacic with a subsequent drowning or uncontrolled ascent and fatal embolism. That is reason enough to practice manipulating the valve even on a single tank - in addition to multiple reg configuration reasons.
If your buddy doesn't understand this reason for practicing valve manipulation.... well, you needn't bother with any further explanation.
As for gear configuration... believe it or not, one can be quite precise, safe, reef-friendly and a superior buddy with a short hose, jacket and single regulator. It ain't the gear, it's the diver.
Rick
ericfine50
Contributor
When people ask me about the DIR configuration, I try to explain in very simple terms and try to tell them it is more than buying the Halcyon gear. Some get it, some look at me with three eyes (what, no retractors or hot pink fins) and think it is crazy. If, they start to think about it, then I guess I got to them - who knows.
Eric
Eric
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