???Future of Open Circuit Mixed Gas and Rebreather Diving???

[broncobowsher]

Rebreather will let you keep the END well under 30m.
You can remember the dive, and watch the narced OC divers

 

[lukeb]

This may be a stupid question but how long does a rebreather unit last? I mean, how long is the software supported, how long are you able to buy parts for it? Like regulators, do you have to worry about not being able to buy service kits down the line? I know next to nothing about the current units except for the familiar names I hear and see when diving. But I wonder if like other developing forms of technology they will be obsolete and updated before I am able to get the full benefit from buying one.

(I am someone who is weighing the OC Trimix route vs. saving for a rebreather. This thread has been really helpful. I was about to pull the trigger on an OC Trimix class at the end of the year, but now I am reconsidering).

 

[Celt]

And there is nothing wrong with that, just don’t drive it like it’s a Porsche.

You might have a lot of xp with being narced at depth and you probably handle yourself ok in a situation like that.
The problem starts when all rec divers think it’s fine to go deep on air, more accidents will happen and dive sites will be closed/stronger regulated.

But why would all rec divers think that without training? You can do a deep air diving course to 60m. Just stay within your training.

 

[broncobowsher]

I am going to say a pretty long time. rEvo came out in 2007 and has had a few changes over the years. But as far as I know there isn't anything that has made the original obsolete. The original Predator computers are no longer serviced, but they can be updated. So much of most rebreathers is interchangeable parts. Hoses are pretty generic. DSV can be swapped out. Some have unicorn parts.

There have been a few that didn't survive the test of time. Hollis Explorer for example. Killed off the moment Huish bought Hollis. Even so they have a good BOV that other rebreathers can use. But the controller was too proprietary and failure prone. Even so KISS made a conversion kit for them.

I really don't see much of the new rebreathers on the market being obsolete any time soon

 

[Wibble]

This may be a stupid question but how long does a rebreather unit last? I mean, how long is the software supported, how long are you able to buy parts for it? Like regulators, do you have to worry about not being able to buy service kits down the line? I know next to nothing about the current units except for the familiar names I hear and see when diving. But I wonder if like other developing forms of technology they will be obsolete and updated before I am able to get the full benefit from buying one.

Most should last a very long time. Looking at one extremely popular rebreather which sold in thousands, the AP Inspiration "Classic". The death of it was when AP stopped supporting the handsets and the head. The electronics in these was very dated and would be very expensive to manufacture in the small volumes to replace broken ones but not sell in large quantities on new units. Basically if the classic handsets fail, that’s it. Hence a classic is worth a few hundred £$€ mainly to existing classic owners. Having said that I believe you can buy a new head, electronics and scrubber upgrades from AP at a price. But who drives a 1950's car aside from '50's enthusiasts?

The big thing to happen is specialist component manufacturers; computers, controllers, mouthpieces, wings, etc. Shearwater is the big dog here as they OEM to many rebreather manufacturers; Revo, JJ, Megladon, Kiss and many others. With specialist component manufacturers having much larger markets there will be support and upgrade paths.

(I am someone who is weighing the OC Trimix route vs. saving for a rebreather. This thread has been really helpful. I was about to pull the trigger on an OC Trimix class at the end of the year, but now I am reconsidering).

Advanced Nitrox and Decompression Procedures (ANDP) is a vital course in advance of rebreather training IMHO. It teaches you about oxygen rich mixes which is core knowledge for rebreather diving, along with stage cylinder management and switching procedures that are essential for bailing out from a rebreather to open circuit.

ANDP enables you to do a lot more Open Circuit diving without helium at shallower depths, i.e. recreational depths, but adding a fair amount of decompression. Example 30m/100ft for an hour's bottom time plus about 25 mins of decompression. Or longer if you’ve the right gasses and two decompression cylinders.

A bit of trimix experience is good for everyone as you learn to be comfortable with gas switching and thoughtful dive planning, especially for reserve contingency.

 

[0utrageousfun]

This may be a stupid question but how long does a rebreather unit last? I mean, how long is the software supported, how long are you able to buy parts for it? Like regulators, do you have to worry about not being able to buy service kits down the line? I know next to nothing about the current units except for the familiar names I hear and see when diving. But I wonder if like other developing forms of technology they will be obsolete and updated before I am able to get the full benefit from buying one.

(I am someone who is weighing the OC Trimix route vs. saving for a rebreather. This thread has been really helpful. I was about to pull the trigger on an OC Trimix class at the end of the year, but now I am reconsidering).

FWIW, the mCCR I'm building experience on now was built in 2008 while I was in high school. It's still going strong.

 

[AJ]

This may be a stupid question but how long does a rebreather unit last? I mean, how long is the software supported, how long are you able to buy parts for it?

I would say the most critical part for longevity is electronics and software. When they are proprietary and the supplier goes out of business, you probably lose support. On the other side of things is Shearwater, Shearwater is a big name in the ccr industry. Different brands of rebreathers use Shearwater controllers. I expect them to be supported a long time to come.

 

[rjack321]

This may be a stupid question but how long does a rebreather unit last? I mean, how long is the software supported, how long are you able to buy parts for it? Like regulators, do you have to worry about not being able to buy service kits down the line? I know next to nothing about the current units except for the familiar names I hear and see when diving. But I wonder if like other developing forms of technology they will be obsolete and updated before I am able to get the full benefit from buying one.

(I am someone who is weighing the OC Trimix route vs. saving for a rebreather. This thread has been really helpful. I was about to pull the trigger on an OC Trimix class at the end of the year, but now I am reconsidering).

Between months (as in a few months) and decades. Some of the original units of the 1990s are still diving and some are way beyond economical repair. It all depends on the unit - the hard part is predicting which will still be supported and viable 15+ yrs from now. Most CCR manufactures are small operations, with a limited longevity (remember hammerheads?) and parts on outdated units are not stocked forever (the Boris was the cat's meow in 2005) even if the manufacturer remains viable. Just dive it while you own it. If $15K is too much then tech diving is not for you. There's a reason scant few 20 somethings are diving CCR. They dont have the financial stability at that point in their lives to make it work.

 

[KenGordon]

As someone who doesn't live near great dive sites, It's sometimes quIte a while between dives for me. Any opinions on the minimum dive frequency needed to keep CCR skills safely fresh? As an example, take a fairly average diver without advanced certs, staying roughly in rec dive depths, and no caves. But someone who's also been diving a long time, and is comfortable in the water and comfortable with OC skills.

Once you have been diving CCR for a while so that is second nature you might get away with big gaps between dives. However, if you never get fully practiced post qualification you will always be a bit uncomfortable and probably at increased risk.

Also there is a high fixed cost of ownership. Even for a minimal 40m max setup you must keep dil, o2 and cylinders in test and o2 clean, plus three cells/year. That is £400 ish/year before getting wet. (I actually have four bailouts and two sets of dil/o2 for practical reasons).

Now and again you might find yourself asking “I know this cell is a year old, but it has only done 10 hours, do I really need to spend £100 replacing it?” If you think you might ever answer “no, I will be fine…” then keep away from CCRs.

 

[BlueTrin]

Once you have been diving CCR for a while so that is second nature you might get away with big gaps between dives. However, if you never get fully practiced post qualification you will always be a bit uncomfortable and probably at increased risk.

Also there is a high fixed cost of ownership. Even for a minimal 40m max setup you must keep dil, o2 and cylinders in test and o2 clean, plus three cells/year. That is £400 ish/year before getting wet. (I actually have four bailouts and two sets of dil/o2 for practical reasons).

Now and again you might find yourself asking “I know this cell is a year old, but it has only done 10 hours, do I really need to spend £100 replacing it?” If you think you might ever answer “no, I will be fine…” then keep away from CCRs.

Add CCR insurance for theft on top too