Frequency of advanced divers practicing CESAs ? [Poll]

Approximately how often have you practiced doing CESAs up till now ?

  • Never.

    Votes: 121 75.2%
  • A few times.

    Votes: 22 13.7%
  • About once every 5-10 years.

    Votes: 2 1.2%
  • About once every 2-4 years.

    Votes: 2 1.2%
  • About once a year.

    Votes: 4 2.5%
  • About once every 5-6 months

    Votes: 1 0.6%
  • About once every 3-4 months.

    Votes: 1 0.6%
  • About once every 1-2 months.

    Votes: 5 3.1%
  • More often then once a month.

    Votes: 3 1.9%

  • Total voters
    161

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dberry

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Sorry, no John. It is referring to the poll by Roger.
A veritable plethora of polls. All based on quite reasonable questions.
 

Kharon

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If you don't teach CESA, what will you expect your students to do if they get themselves in the situation where they need it?

An excellent case for teaching the importance of and the use of an alternate air source - pony - and requiring one to be carried. Hell of a lot better than a CESA.
 

TMHeimer

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I'm the one who voted more often than once a month. My thoughts--
--My usual diving is no deeper than 20-30 feet, on occasion a little deeper, maybe even touch 40.
Half hour/40 minute type dives, so not a whole lot of offgassing. I go very slowly, though I doubt faster from 25' would create much of a problem.
--30' in 30 seconds means a foot a second, which at least used to be the PADI recommendation.
--I don't think it would be wise at all to do a 90' dive, get to 30' then practice a CESA.
--I always practice it vertically in the ocean as I agree horizontally doesn't do much.
--I always begin my CESA with about half full lungs---figuring if I had enough air in the tank to take a full breath I'd have enough to start a normal ascent. I realize students are told to take a big breath first (one said take 3 breaths, which is now a no-no called hyperventilation). I can still make it at a slow rate. I have never recommended that students practice this after certification, but occasionally pointed out that if they actually had to do it they probably wouldn't have full lungs to start.
--Agree that you should do all that stuff mentioned (check air often, gas plan, dive plan, etc.) to eliminate the need for CESA. That seems obvious to me.
--Almost all of my dives are solo, so I have no buddy to share air with or to have my air checked by the buddy. I practice it just in case something really weird happens-- like for some reason I'm getting no Air. Maybe it's that one in 10 million times the reg craps out and doesn't free flow (I know, same chances as being killed by a shark, etc.).
--When I checked "more than once a month" that probably means 2 or 3 times or so. I usually dive once weekly, and do a CESA once in a while since I'm surfacing to check location anyway.
--I can see how it can be a concern for instructors doing multiple CESAS in a day (though I haven't heard of anyone at our shop having a problem). I guess there could be a concern for DCS going up & down a lot, even from 20-30'.
--Diving solo, I figure it's just a tiny but more peace of mind knowing that if I'm airless for some weird reason, I can easily get to the surface. I'm not concerned about safety doing it 2-3 times a month. I don't hold my breath......
--Agree with Dirty-Dog--No reason to bring freediving into this discussion--not relevant.
--Pointless to bring up the "what is Advanced" thing either. A CESA is the same for everyone.
--
 

The Chairman

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I am having trouble seeing how those points demonstrate that an OOG diver does not need to have the confidence that doing the CESA will bring him or her to the surface alive.
You seem to underestimate the totality of panic. Confidence goes out the window with panic. Training has little to do with mitigating panic. Staying in control and not running out of air has a lot to do with mitigating panic. However, vertical CESAs, even in training, expose the diver and the instructor to real and unnecessary risks that a horizontal CESA will not. Moreover, more than one student can do a horizontal CESA at the same time, allowing the instructor to make sure they have enough practice to perfect the process and enable muscle memory without exposing them over and over to those risks.
 

The Chairman

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An excellent case for teaching the importance of and the use of an alternate air source - pony
Or gas planning and adequate buddy skills.
 
OP
Roger Hobden

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I wasn't sure what to expect when I created this thread (which is why I created it).
What am I getting from the comments so far, and this is the reason why the poll was created with such a wide range of choices, is this:

If you practice a CESA only once during your initial training, and never practice it again, the chances that you get it right in case of an emergency are not that good.
OTOH, if you practice it correctly on a regular basis, your chances of performing it efficiently and effectively when the need arises are probably increased.
It is a procedural type of knowledge, and can only be learned correctly by repeating the procedure again and again until it is fully mastered, ideally under the watchful eye of a highly trained and qualified instructor.
 

TMHeimer

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I wasn't sure what to expect when I created this thread (which is why I created it).
What am I getting from the comments so far, and this is the reason why the poll was created with such a wide range of choices, is this:

If you practice a CESA only once during your initial training, and never practice it again, the chances that you get it right in case of an emergency are not that good.
OTOH, if you practice it correctly on a regular basis, your chances of performing it efficiently and effectively when the need arises are probably increased.
It is a procedural type of knowledge, and can only be learned correctly by repeating the procedure again and again until it is fully mastered, ideally under the watchful eye of a highly trained and qualified instructor.
Agree with all. Same thing with any skill.
Oh, wait a minute...."repeating again and again until it is fully mastered"..... Reminds me of the "mastering" discussion in Basic in Watered Down Training thread.
 

KenGordon

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If you don't teach CESA, what will you expect your students to do if they get themselves in the situation where they need it?

Drown.

There are a lot of ways to avoid being in this situation. At least two failures have to have happened. First a lack of gas, and second a lack of alternative gas. Maybe if they understand the concequences of allowing this to happen they will be more diligent.
 
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