Feeling ripped off by LDS – please advise.

[Stu S.]

It puts less risk on scuba manufacturers to sell products through small independent dealers. No manufacturer looks forward to sitting down with the buyers from Wal-Mart or Home Depot to negotiate price and delivery. They are the big guys, and the financial performance of your company is on the line. A company may get negotiated right out of business.

The big dive retailers are still small potatoes compared to a Sears or Lowe's with their national market clout. Dive gear, like my first regulator, used to be sold through department store chains. That route from manufacturer to customer typically results in lower prices. Ask yourself.... is the savings is worth having the company who makes your gear constantly "on the ropes"? Oh yeah, I've worked in Manufacturing for 30 years.

Happy Shopping! Happy Diving!

 

[Carribeandiver]

I bought my reg (ScubaPro MK11 & R290), BC (ScubaPro Glide Plus) and computer (ScubaPro/Uwatec SmartCom) from one dive shop to the tune of $2000. From the only other shop in town I bought a mask ($60 more than LeisurePro), weights, weight belt, OW training, misc clips & retractors, and a few other items that totaled around $1500. I bought my fins, snorkel, lights, knife, dive skin and a couple wetsuits online. Each of those online items were significantly cheaper than either LDS. As a matter of fact, I could have literally saved $400-500 by buying the items I purchased at the LDS had I bought them online.
I agree support the local LDS,,,but to a point. Several hundreds of dollars is beyond ridiculous. Authorized dealers cannot sell below the manufacturer's MAP price, period. The MAP price in most cases still allows dealers to make 40 to 100% profit; I believe that is enough to remain in business. There is no reason to rip people off...unless you consider that most LDS have very seasonal business. Slow times can kill them.
Which is why they offer dive trips. Now I ask, one of my two LDS is offering a trip to Roatan for $2400. I was excited and a whisker away from signing up but I had to confirm the time off and waited. For the heck of it, I researched the EXACT trip at the EXACT time and lo and behold the trip was $500 less if I did it independently. Now I ask, why should I book the trip with the dive shop?
I no longer deal with the other dive shop because they cancelled two dive trips at the last minute (the day before both times ) and I had to eat hotel expenses and travel expenses. If they cant get enough to make the trip profittable, that is not my problem, we had a deal and for them to cancel only makes me a partner in their venture when all I really am is a customer.
So, in short, if you can get quality products that are warranted and sold by an authorized dealer, I say go online.
And BIGCAPE, you have no valid argument, but for the record, I have owned a retail business, a manufacturing business and a wholesale distribution business. In none of those businesses did I consider my problems to be my customer's problems. If I could not buy in volume, I made less until I built up my business. Why should my customers pay for my inabiity to compete with the big boys?

 

[Stu S.]

Does anyone want to share information as to how much less a big internet scuba retailer pays compared to the little guy? Some manufacturers associate a "buy locally" pitch with their products.

My local store (part of a small chain) gave me a full manufacturer's warranty on a Sherwood BC. I thought this was valuable. Then, I had a problem, and they told me to contact Sherwood directly. That was my job, not their's. That made me and Sherwood both unhappy. This shop could not fix an octo in two attempts. I had to give them the "Bill Parcells stare" in order for them to hand over a new one. LDS = service? You decide.

My Cressi computer came from Leisure Pro. It has a full manufacturer's warranty, not a LP warranty. The computer had a small anomoly that was not safety related. I received a new replacement quickly.

Buying from the big store was a more satisfactory experience than buying from the local little guy. A happy scuba consumer will probably buy more stuff. Why would anyone want it otherwise?

 

[mdb]

Does anyone want to share information as to how much less a big internet scuba retailer pays compared to the little guy? Some manufacturers associate a "buy locally" pitch with their products.

Stu S. LP buys direct from most manufacturers /distributors. Some just choose to deny that they sell direct and say that LP is not "authorized". The "best price" available to large volume buyers is often "off the price list" and, at least, 15-20% below what the LDS guys are paying. LP uses the normal discount mark up of 50%-a 33% gross margin. Many local dive stores still price at 100-120% mark up, 50-60%+ gross margins. This difference, plus the "inside" pricing creates the 20% + plus discount.

 

[RS]

I'm in the process of buying a new wetsuit. I ordered a mares isotherm online at a great price, and it's a great suit. But I realized 2 things; I hate the back zip and the fit is a little tighter than I can stand, so I'm returning it. Shipping both ways is about $40. Then I went to a local discount dive shack (not my local DS) and bought a Scubamax semidry that seemed to fit pretty good. Jumped in the pool and the backzip leaks like crazy. No way I'm using that in 55d. So, I'm trying to get a refund on suit #2. I think now I'll go to my local guy for either a good fitting wetsuit or a drysuit, and start having fun.

 

[james croft]

I once bought a new Zeagle Ranger from a LDS. After about 50 dives I noticed it was leaking at the corrugated inflator hose elbow where it screwed into the bladder. I took it back to my LDS and felt it should have been a warranty issue. They told me it was not covered. They kept it about 3 weeks and billed me $16.00 for the repair. I inflated it and five minutes later the bladder was deflated. I investigated the repair and found teflon plumbing tape wrapped around the damaged threads. It was a BS repair and a dangerous one. I sent it back to Zeagle, got a new bladder, fast turn around time of about a week, and no charge. All the LDS did was scam me. I still buy certain equipment from the same LDS as they have very good prices on certain items but I will never use them for a repair again. I learned a lesson the first time.

 

[Brewone0to]

NOBODY got ripped off reread my first post!!!!

I don't know what shops in your area get for those,
But, in Tampa,Fla there are several shops that get 38-45 for that very item.
I don't work at,for,or own a shop.
I personally think that 50% over other retail shops defines a high price.
Keeping that in mind, I buy items from my LDS for 15-25% more than
what I can get them in other places, because I like his fills and service.
He knows that I'm aware of where I can beat the prices he charges,
but where would I be if not for him and the services he provides?
Of course OTOH, he doesn't try to make his whole space rent on one sale.

 

[Bigcape]

Hey guys Everybody referrers to "my local LDS" or "on-line" as if they were a mechanical vending machine. Don't forget PEOPLE are behind each one. PEOPLE are responsible for the service good or bad.

Where I live there are over 20 LDS's and I can name the jerks and the nice PEOPLE.

Same goes for online staff: PEOPLE

 

[Bigcape]

And BIGCAPE, you have no valid argument, but for the record, I have owned a retail business, a manufacturing business and a wholesale distribution business. In none of those businesses did I consider my problems to be my customer's problems. If I could not buy in volume, I made less until I built up my business. Why should my customers pay for my inabiity to compete with the big boys?

I have no valid argument??? My point is............If you say "YES ILL BUY IT" then you have nothing to complain about, unless you are under the age of 18 and considered incompetent.

I am not in retail. But, if you don't like my price then go elsewhere and stop WHINING about it GHEEEEEEEEeeeeeeeeeeeeeeez

"how much do you want for you your car?"
"$$$$$.$$"
"thats toooo much, you must be trying to rip me off"

 

[TSandM]

You know, it isn't just dive shops. Almost anything I want to buy, I could drive around the Seattle area and find a range of prices on it. If it's an expensive item, I'll do the homework and try to find where I can get it with the best value for my money (eg. best service contract, longest warranty, or lowest price). If it's an inexpensive item, I buy it where I find it, and if I find out later somebody else sells it cheaper, I just kick myself a little.

I patronize two local dive shops. If I'm going to buy something, I first go to the shop where I think they are most likely to actually HAVE it -- as in, in stock. If it has to be ordered, I may as well buy it one line. If I know I can get it on line, I offer the shop the opportunity to match (or come near) the on line price (including shipping). Sometimes they can, sometimes they can't or won't.

I honestly don't know how scuba shops stay open at all. I buy very little these days, and most of that is small stuff like boltsnaps. Big stuff, I'm buying from other people, mostly, like my recent doubled 72s. I think that's true of a lot of divers. They buy new from the dive shops when they start, but after a year or so, they're wiser, and buy used or buy on line or whatever minimizes COST. Dive shops have got to be very low profit operations, and I feel for them. Not enough to buy much new any more, but I empathize.