Fatality Horseshoe Bay May 21/10

[retireddiver]

Without Prejudice

I was asked to post more information as to what evolved Friday May 21st.
I have asked permission from the father of the deceased to do this post.
Firstly if you do not already know, the name of the diver who lost his life is a close friend and a faithful employee Tim Grant (timgrant.ca).

I would also like you all to know this post is NOT about placing blame on any individual however; hope can be used as a tool to help prevent future accidents.

The following is a recount of events as personally told by the surviving diver (my brother).
I also attended the scene with WV police detec T and bro.

Approx 6-6:30 pm they suited up at parking lot @ Ansell pl walked the 64 steps to the water, swam south towards Pasco Rd. If you google 8285 Pasco rd you will see the last house on road with an excavator at north end of house, look 90 deg from house next to excavator and google approx 200 ft out, this is where the incident occurred
.
At approx 100’ Tim dropped the spear gun, which sank to approx 120ft.
A 3 min struggle ensued between the divers; Tim wanted to retrieve the gun, however my bro felt it to be too unsafe. At the beginning of the struggle my bro noted he had 1500 psi in his tank, at the end of struggle he realized he was down to 500 psi thus felt he must abandon his dive buddy in order to save his own life, so he followed the lay of the land towards shore, stopping for a 45sec decomp, once he surfaced he was on the wall just in front of the blue tarp on the house (small bay, big tree).
Once he had surfaced he hollered for help, within a small time frame Tim surfaced crying for assistance. My bro swam back in attempt to save him; by the time he reached Tim, he was already unconscious. Bro brought Tim to shore and tried to revive him, however the rock bluff hindered attempts.
Emergency personnel attended the scene however all attempts to revive Tim were unsuccessful.

I’m sure there are going to be many questions asked, as I have many myself, HOWEVER, the case is in the capable hand of the coroners.
Once again the purpose of this post is not to lay blame, however, I feel diving is a very safe sport PROVIDING PROTOCALL IS FOLLOWED BY ALL. Lets learn and live.


Safe Diving to All
WetRookie said it best

Regards
Brian

 

[retireddiver]

Without Prejudice

I was asked to post more information as to what evolved Friday May 21st.
I have asked permission from the father of the deceased to do this post.
Firstly if you do not already know, the name of the diver who lost his life is a close friend and a faithful employee Tim Grant (timgrant.ca).

I would also like you all to know this post is NOT about placing blame on any individual however; hope can be used as a tool to help prevent future accidents.

The following is a recount of events as personally told by the surviving diver (my brother).
I also attended the scene with WV police detec T and bro.

Approx 6-6:30 pm they suited up at parking lot @ Ansell pl walked the 64 steps to the water, swam south towards Pasco Rd. If you google 8285 Pasco rd you will see the last house on road with an excavator at north end of house, look 90 deg from house next to excavator and google approx 200 ft out, this is where the incident occurred
.
At approx 100’ Tim dropped the spear gun, which sank to approx 120ft.
A 3 min struggle ensued between the divers; Tim wanted to retrieve the gun, however my bro felt it to be too unsafe. At the beginning of the struggle my bro noted he had 1500 psi in his tank, at the end of struggle he realized he was down to 500 psi thus felt he must abandon his dive buddy in order to save his own life, so he followed the lay of the land towards shore, stopping for a 45sec decomp, once he surfaced he was on the wall just in front of the blue tarp on the house (small bay, big tree).
Once he had surfaced he hollered for help, within a small time frame Tim surfaced crying for assistance. My bro swam back in attempt to save him; by the time he reached Tim, he was already unconscious. Bro brought Tim to shore and tried to revive him, however the rock bluff hindered attempts.
Emergency personnel attended the scene however all attempts to revive Tim were unsuccessful.

I’m sure there are going to be many questions asked, as I have many myself, HOWEVER, the case is in the capable hand of the coroners.
Once again the purpose of this post is not to lay blame, however, I feel diving is a very safe sport PROVIDING PROTOCALL IS FOLLOWED BY ALL. Lets learn and live.


Safe Diving to All
WetRookie said it best

Regards
Brian

 

[Slamfire]

Retired diver,

My most sincere condolences as well as thanks for your contribution to our community. I am particularly thankful given that this is not an easy time for you and your family.

Warning: clicking on the spoiler button below will reveal some of the many questions about this case. Retired Diver, the last thing I want to do is to add pressure or discomfort. Please feel free to ignore any or all of my questions.

Spoiler

- Do you know whether the divers where using air, nitrox, or another breathable mix?

- Is it your opinion or your brother's that the struggle was at least partly fueled by narcosis?

- Do you know how much gas was left in the tank(s) of the deceased?

- Do you know if there were any equipment malfunctions?

- Can you tell us about the experience level of the divers?

- It would be good to find out the coroner's findings regarding arterial gas embolism, decompression sickness, etc.

- Are there any further questions we could answer or any topics you wish to have our opinions?

- Would you be interested in going for a dive or two in Ansell? I usually dive on Saturdays and I'm sure others would join us.

Again, many thanks.

 

[Julian55]

I hope your brother is ok. Thanks for the info

 

[gcbryan]

Thanks for posting. Why did your brother feel that it was unsafe to go another 20 feet deeper to get the spear gun and what was the "struggle" all about?

Is it your feeling that everyone involved was too deep in the first place and were also too low on air to be there?

Thanks. I'm just trying to see what the problem was and what happened before the "incident" and afterwards. What caused Tim's death...was it an embolism?

I'm just trying to figure out what the lesson to be learned is.

 

[DandyDon]

I appreciate that you are helping out by conveying information give to you, but I am really curious about this part if I may...?

At approx 100’ Tim dropped the spear gun, which sank to approx 120ft.
A 3 min struggle ensued between the divers; Tim wanted to retrieve the gun, however my bro felt it to be too unsafe. At the beginning of the struggle my bro noted he had 1500 psi in his tank, at the end of struggle he realized he was down to 500 psi thus felt he must abandon his dive buddy in order to save his own life, so he followed the lay of the land towards shore, stopping for a 45sec decomp, once he surfaced he was on the wall just in front of the blue tarp on the house (small bay, big tree).
Once he had surfaced he hollered for help, within a small time frame Tim surfaced crying for assistance. My bro swam back in attempt to save him; by the time he reached Tim, he was already unconscious. Bro brought Tim to shore and tried to revive him, however the rock bluff hindered attempts.

I don't understand why your brother objected, much less struggled for 3 minutes? A quick drop from 100 to 120 if both had 1500# to pickup the speargun doesn't sound unreasonable, but if they couldn't agree - why not just watch Tim from 100 as he dips down? I firmly believe in buddies staying together, but a brief 20 separation doesn't sound bad. At the worst, I have had buddies go deeper than I wanted to - without warning, so I hovered, waited, and had words later out of the water.

"...45sec decomp...."

Did your brother know that Tim was in trouble even before he surfaced? It would seem so from his described actions, but not covered in your explanation.

thanks!​

 

[CapitanBlack]

My condolences to the family of deceased...

I don't understand why your brother objected, much less struggled for 3 minutes? A quick drop from 100 to 120 if both had 1500# to pickup the speargun doesn't sound unreasonable,

I am sorry - but, I would not go down either... Just imagine yourself under 100' of dark water, arguing to a buddy who breath 333(!) psi per minute (1000 psi per 3 minutes). The stress SCR is defined as 1 cu. ft / min., which at 100' and assuming AL80 tank, equals to DCR of 160 psi / min. This person was breathing more than two times harder... I am pretty sure that even at the beginning of the struggle Tim already had a HUGE stress and was very close to uncontrollable panic. This situation can scare anyone deep to the bones and life-saving instinct will take over...

According the DIR Rock Bottom rules - 1500 psi in AL80 tank at 100' is the Rock Bottom volume. Divers MUST start ascending immediately, because if one of them will loose all gas - 1500 psi is enough to safely bring them both to the surface.

 

[retireddiver]

Amen to all you have said, I hope the investigation will reveal the answers to all our questions?????

 

[cruiser]

Thank you for posting the chain of events. We want to learn from these experiences, and all too often the facts are few and far between.

I too have a couple question about the cause of the struggle. Was your brother attempting to keep Tim from going deeper? Or was Tim trying to get your brother to descend with hiim?

Again, just trying to get a clearer understanding of how things progressed, not to place judgment anywhere.

 

[gcbryan]

Amen to all you have said, I hope the investigation will reveal the answers to all our questions?????

Doesn't your brother have most of these answers? Or is he not wanting to talk about this right now?

The questions most of us (I'm guessing) would be interested in are :

1. Why did they go that far away from Ansell Point (better fishing)?

2. If everything was fine (?) until Tim dropped the spear gun what was the 3 minute struggle about? Was it just that your brother, as a newer diver, wasn't comfortable being left alone if Tim were to drop down to retrieve it?

3. If everything was fine with Tim at the point that your brother left (because of his low air situation) why did he start calling for help before Tim surfaced? What help did he feel Tim needed at that point?

It seems your brother could provide all those answers. Perhaps he can't answer question 4.

4. What was the problem that Tim was having on the surface? Was he fine but ran out of air and possibly drowned not thinking to drop his weights? Embolism from a breath hold ascent? Do you know if his tank was found to be empty?