FAKE NEWS!!--PADI to be sold once again

[MargaritaMike]

I guess if you need replacement C-cards you shouldn't wait as I have.

just because your instructor tells you something doesn't make it so.

Didn't we just beat this to death in another thread?

Exemplifies the term "Put Another Dollar In" - prices go up and service goes down.

Can we have a big " AMEN "

Cheers -

 

[Birddog1911]

Yeah, that's pretty much wishful thinking on his part. just because your instructor tells you something doesn't make it so.

It may not be the case, yet, but the possibility exists to become reality. PADI cut the throats of their dive shops in the last year, and many are pissed off enough to leave. SSI has courted our shop for years, and we just officially became a SSI dive center, and have left PADI. Like I said in the other thread, I know that at least the biggest 3, and I believe 3 others in the state, have left PADI.

 

[Addicted2H2O]

Not that it really has any place here but then again it sort of bares mentioning....I think NAUI might be doing the same type of thing. They've now added two additional mandatory courses in order to qualify for the DM program, plus an additional 10 open water dives. The additional dives aren't really an issue seeing as how a single dive only constitutes 20 minutes or more at minimum 20 ft. Not hard to get the additional dives in a weekend. But additional courses added in a year? Why? Now it's required to be certified as a Master Diver and then have to take their F.I.T. course as well? Maybe there's some good in them, but the only justification I can see for them is forcing divers to spend additional money on certifications. I've already got the dives required for both courses. But now I have to spend an additional ($500?) on coursework to even qualify? Sounds greedy to me.

But I digress.....back to the PADI discussion.

 

[Sam Miller III]

from a previous post

in 1948, 70 years ago, Aqua Lung was established by Rene Bussoz in the corner of his LA based haberdashery with 10 Aqua Lungs
He called the company Rene Sports until 1952 when it was changed to US Divers

In 1969, 49 years ago, PADI was established by John Cronin, Ralph Ericksen et all at Downers Grove Illinois. John was promoted to an executive position with US Divers, brought a cardboard box containing PADI applicants to SoCal with him, pulled Nic Icorn, an active LA Co UW instructor off a drafting table to organize amd create an effective dive program

Now the two are worth 1.2 BILLION !

Sam Miller, III
​

@Eric Sedletzky
"It’s too bad when it started as a group of dedicated dive instructors wanting to form an association to make dive training better, and now it seems to be all about the money."

If you truly believe your statement then you also believe in Santa Claus and the Easter bunny !
sdm,

 

[chrispscott]

Not that it really has any place here but then again it sort of bares mentioning....I think NAUI might be doing the same type of thing. They've now added two additional mandatory courses in order to qualify for the DM program, plus an additional 10 open water dives. The additional dives aren't really an issue seeing as how a single dive only constitutes 20 minutes or more at minimum 20 ft. Not hard to get the additional dives in a weekend. But additional courses added in a year? Why? Now it's required to be certified as a Master Diver and then have to take their F.I.T. course as well? Maybe there's some good in them, but the only justification I can see for them is forcing divers to spend additional money on certifications. I've already got the dives required for both courses. But now I have to spend an additional ($500?) on coursework to even qualify? Sounds greedy to me.

But I digress.....back to the PADI discussion.

This isn't necessarily accurate. NAUI does not require the DM candidate to be a NAUI Master Diver.

The Candidate is required to be a NAUI Master Diver "or equivalent" which PADI Master Diver qualifies as being. FIT exists because PADI Master Diver does not contain the same knowledge base as NAUI Master Diver and it serves as a diagnostic tool as to what the candidate might need to work on before entering an Instructor Training or DM Course.

NAUI doesn't teach things like General Gas Law in the DM or ITC as the candidate is expected to already have that knowledge coming from Master Diver. PADI teaches it in DM not Master Diver. So it's to address an imbalance of expected knowledge coming from Master Diver between agencies.

I used to give a NAUI Master Diver test to instructor candidates if they did not come up through the ranks under me. Most people coming from PADI to my course failed and not through any fault of their own. They failed because PADI and NAUI teach Instructor level knowledge at different places in the course progression. FIT is meant to remedy that imbalance but I think NAUI could do a better job of explaining and implementing it.

For dive professionals coming to NAUI from another agency the Recognition of Prior Learning form gives them credit in the FIT program if they've done everything in the past. It might seem a bit odious until you actually sit down and do the program and realize that the person coming into the program has done most everything already in previous training. My last crossover from SSI was an NPS diver and their yearly training covered the most of the FIT requirements.

I'm a former NAUI Midwest Regional Manager and HQs explanation and communication of this was a bit of sticking point for me. But I don't think it's a money grab.

 

[cool_hardware52]

That's what private equity funds aim to do, although most of the ones I know about have a 5 year timeline to do so. To be able to do that in much less than that, shows...I'm not sure what it shows. Good for them I guess.

Brian, I'd suggest it shows that Padi was under pricing their goods and services by quite a lot. The PE guys no doubt knew that when they bought the company. I suspect the contraction of the scuba industry will reduce competition for PADI and increase their pricing power. Typical of shakeouts.

As shops close which will go first, the larger Padi affiliated shops or the newer, smaller shop that went with some other agency? Of course many variables apply to each region and each set of shops, but it easy to see Padi being around 5-10 years from now and much of the alphabet soup of 2nd tier agencies being nothing but memories.

None of the above reflects my opinions on the relative quality of the training of any of the agencies, just the marketing and pricing power.

Tobin

 

[Birddog1911]

Brian, I'd suggest it shows that Padi was under pricing their goods and services by quite a lot. The PE guys no doubt knew that when they bought the company. I suspect the contraction of the scuba industry will reduce competition for PADI and increase their pricing power. Typical of shakeouts.

As shops close which will go first, the larger Padi affiliated shops or the newer, smaller shop that went with some other agency? Of course many variables apply to each region and each set of shops, but it easy to see Padi being around 5-10 years from now and much of the alphabet soup of 2nd tier agencies being nothing but memories.

None of the above reflects my opinions on the relative quality of the training of any of the agencies, just the marketing and pricing power.

Tobin

One problem PADI is having, however, are large PADI affiliated shops leaving PADI, and going to other agencies. That is going to hurt them.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

In 1969, 49 years ago, PADI was established by John Cronin, Ralph Ericksen et all at Downers Grove Illinois.​

1966.
And you left out the bottle of Johnny Walker!

Now the two are worth 1.2 BILLION !

Imagine that​

@Eric Sedletzky
"It’s too bad when it started as a group of dedicated dive instructors wanting to form an association to make dive training better, and now it seems to be all about the money."

If you truly believe your statement then you also believe in Santa Claus and the Easter bunny !
sdm,

Huh???

 

[Addicted2H2O]

This isn't necessarily accurate. NAUI does not require the DM candidate to be a NAUI Master Diver.

The Candidate is required to be a NAUI Master Diver "or equivalent" which PADI Master Diver qualifies as being. FIT exists because PADI Master Diver does not contain the same knowledge base as NAUI Master Diver and it serves as a diagnostic tool as to what the candidate might need to work on before entering an Instructor Training or DM Course.

NAUI doesn't teach things like General Gas Law in the DM or ITC as the candidate is expected to already have that knowledge coming from Master Diver. PADI teaches it in DM not Master Diver. So it's to address an imbalance of expected knowledge coming from Master Diver between agencies.

I used to give a NAUI Master Diver test to instructor candidates if they did not come up through the ranks under me. Most people coming from PADI to my course failed and not through any fault of their own. They failed because PADI and NAUI teach Instructor level knowledge at different places in the course progression. FIT is meant to remedy that imbalance but I think NAUI could do a better job of explaining and implementing it.

For dive professionals coming to NAUI from another agency the Recognition of Prior Learning form gives them credit in the FIT program if they've done everything in the past. It might seem a bit odious until you actually sit down and do the program and realize that the person coming into the program has done most everything already in previous training. My last crossover from SSI was an NPS diver and their yearly training covered the most of the FIT requirements.

I'm a former NAUI Midwest Regional Manager and HQs explanation and communication of this was a bit of sticking point for me. But I don't think it's a money grab.

And I can certainly understand that if the DM candidate is coming from another agency. But ALL of my training, with the exception of my recent NASE Rescue (I also got the NAUI Rescue & Advanced Rescue at the same time) has been under NAUI. And as far as training goes, I like NAUI. I like that their training is so safety oriented. But why all the extra hoops to jump through all of a sudden for those that have come up through the NAUI ranks?

 

[chrispscott]

And I can certainly understand that if the DM candidate is coming from another agency. But ALL of my training, with the exception of my recent NASE Rescue (I also got the NAUI Rescue & Advanced Rescue at the same time) has been under NAUI. And as far as training goes, I like NAUI. I like that their training is so safety oriented. But why all the extra hoops to jump through all of a sudden for those that have come up through the NAUI ranks?

If you've come up through NAUI's stysten then you'll have done NAUI Master Diver ("or equivalent" which has always been a requirement for leadership level courses.) If you do NAUI FIT and immediately follow it with DM then you won't have to repeat the skills for DM that you did for FIT. For my DM candidates who came up through NAUI I usually just sell them the FIT kit at cost and bake it into the price of the course.