Eon core versus sheerwater perdix AI

[scubadada]

I believe Buhlmann and DSAT take the SI into appropriate account when calculating NDL for repetitive dives. Treatment of shorter SIs is a major difference between Suunto RGBM and these deco algorithms. Personally, I don't know if is this is different for Fused RGBM (Core and Steele)/Fused RGBM 2 (D5)/Technical RGBM (run by Fused at Rec depths). Fused 2 is said to be more liberal on repetitive dives.

 

[scubadada]

With the Suunto you can plan with Suunto supplied software. With ‘ZHL16C’ computers you plan with some bit of software which might be the same or not depending on choices made by the implementation.

In both cases the chances are the dive will use less gas and have less deco than planned because dives are not usually completely square.

You are correct, when there is only a single source of planning, you will get one answer. With several sources of planning for Buhlmann with GF you may get slightly different answers due to implementation, but they are quite close.

 

[GRH]

I apologize for reviving an old thread but after reading the replies, while lots of discussion on algorithms, lock outs and other features, not much on what I thought was the main question; which is easier to read for older divers with diminishing eyesight?

On just that "feature", is one better than the other for us older divers or are they close enough that shouldn't be an issue? In my case I don't plan on tech diving, conservative is fine, monitoring multiple tanks is not required and I have a back up even if I was to get locked out.

 

[Edward3c]

I apologize for reviving an old thread but after reading the replies, while lots of discussion on algorithms, lock outs and other features, not much on what I thought was the main question; which is easier to read for older divers with diminishing eyesight?

On just that "feature", is one better than the other for us older divers or are they close enough that shouldn't be an issue? In my case I don't plan on tech diving, conservative is fine, monitoring multiple tanks is not required and I have a back up even if I was to get locked out.

Having read the thread you should have picked up that the majority on this board don’t like Sunnto. I’ve been using an EON Steel for two years. The display is bright and clear enough for my buddies to read it from 2m or more. It’s been used in both tropical and U.K. waters.

 

[KenGordon]

I apologize for reviving an old thread but after reading the replies, while lots of discussion on algorithms, lock outs and other features, not much on what I thought was the main question; which is easier to read for older divers with diminishing eyesight?

On just that "feature", is one better than the other for us older divers or are they close enough that shouldn't be an issue? In my case I don't plan on tech diving, conservative is fine, monitoring multiple tanks is not required and I have a back up even if I was to get locked out.

Both the Perdix and the Eon Core have good displays, the Suunto probably has the edge but both are completely functional.

it is actually very difficult to get locked out, the Suunto haters of SB go on and on about this while also saying that anyone how cannot hold a stop to within 10 cm should take up golf. You have to be above your ceiling for 3 minutes to get locked out. That ceiling is typically quite shallow and being above it that long very unlikely. Really people get locked out by either ignoring their computer or not understanding what is says and getting out of the water with deco owing.

 

[jborg]

The display is bright and clear enough for my buddies to read it from 2m or more.

I'm just getting into the phase where eyesight is becoming an issue when reading in general and when reading dive computers specifically... I have a nice large-screen dive computer for this reason, and yet suspect I could read it easier from 2m away than when it's on my own arm. I've realized that carrying it on the back of my hand helps with this a bit.

(No opinion on the Eon vs Perdix issue as I only have experience of one of them. I suspect they are similar in this respect though.)

 

[Gareth J]

I am interested in this issue with Suunto lockout in the USA.

Having owned a Suunto, in various versions since the early 90's, I have never seen a Suunto lock out.
I have seen a depth sensor failure, I had one myself in the late 90's. I sent it into Suunto who gave me 50% of the replacement.

Even when I switched to CCR, I used to carry a Vytec as a backup. Set the bottom gas for the Max depth (PO2 1.3), then gas switch to 50% and 80% on the way up. (Partly because Dive Time and Depth was easier to read on the Suunto.)
(These days on CCR I normally carry an OSTC as backup.)

I have seen a couple of lockouts, on the Uwatec's over the years. I don't think that was a Uwatec issue, just user error.
On both occasions, divers who weren't used to decompression diving (not trained by us). On one, I know the computer flipped from an NDL dive to 1 minute of decoding the ascent. We looked at the profile data once back at the dig's.

Is it a function of poor diver training, or how divers are taught decompression theory?

Historically, our club would have been 90% Suunto, 9% Uwatec. Even when the VR3 came on stream, the majority with VR3's, also had Suunto's. Not sure where we are these days, probably 85% Suunto's as a minimum. We have a few Shearwaters and OSTC's and a number of 'others'. We still have a few VR3's in the club, but at least 2 have been 'retired' this year (replaced with Suunto Steels or EON's).

It's really rare to see computer failures. The very rare problems we see are normally down to operator error.

 

[Marie13]

I apologize for reviving an old thread but after reading the replies, while lots of discussion on algorithms, lock outs and other features, not much on what I thought was the main question; which is easier to read for older divers with diminishing eyesight?

On just that "feature", is one better than the other for us older divers or are they close enough that shouldn't be an issue? In my case I don't plan on tech diving, conservative is fine, monitoring multiple tanks is not required and I have a back up even if I was to get locked out.

I can read my Perdix clearly even in the often low viz water I’m diving in. I need readers out of the water, but no issues with the Perdix.

 

[Julius SCHMIDT]

No really grab a mask that has lenses that are this shape, there are probably a couple of dozen of them that fits good then slap in a couple of plus one lenses with none of that gauge reader malarky and you will never look back, twice, and you will see things you haven't seen for years just like new diving again

for tired eyed bolder older divers

 

[d^2b]

I am interested in this issue with Suunto lockout in the USA.

Is it a function of poor diver training, or how divers are taught decompression theory?

Historically, our club would have been 90% Suunto, 9% Uwatec. Even when the VR3 came on stream, the majority with VR3's, also had Suunto's. Not sure where we are these days, probably 85% Suunto's as a minimum. We have a few Shearwaters and OSTC's and a number of 'others'. We still have a few VR3's in the club, but at least 2 have been 'retired' this year (replaced with Suunto Steels or EON's).

It's really rare to see computer failures. The very rare problems we see are normally down to operator error.

I don't have deco training, but I don't think it's relevant to the cases I have seen.
I have had a suunto zoop novo lock up twice as follows. Enter the water without the computer in dive mode. Somewhere between 5 and 10 m deep, observe the computer is not going into dive mode; return (slowly, according the ascent meter on the computer) . At that point the computer goes into "Er" mode and locks for 48 hours. I sent the computer to Huish for service, but they could not duplicate the problem, and basically agreed with you that it was probably user error. They are within their legal rights I guess, but I'm not buying Huish owned brands in the near future. The LDS had a theory that the problem was caused by the bungee mount (it was a zoop bungee mount and not a zoop novo). I made 8 or nine dives without the bungee mount and the problem did not re-occur, but that's pretty inconclusive, since it was only occuring every 20 dives or so in the mount. It could also be some depth sensor related problem, although I understood that those were less intermittent.