newdiverAZ
Contributor
has somebody actually died while wearing them?
Does a Long Hose set up require training?
- Thread starter blackice
- Start date
Please register or login
Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.
Benefits of registering include
- Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
- A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
- You can make this box go away
Soggy
Contributor
I don't know.
I am just suggesting that you do some reading...GUE (and consequently DIR) has some very strong feelings regarding them.
newdiverAZ
Contributor
but why do they call them wings of death if noone has died because of them?
Soggy
Contributor
I personally don't know the history....do a search and you may be able to figure that out.
liormic
Guest
The longhose isn't stuffed, the sleave wich contains it is.
Well, I'm not going to argue about what's right and what's wrong. I belive that people do it that way bacause they feel it's the best way. I don't, and I know many who think and act like me.
Sometimes we should understand that there are stuff wich has more than one right answer or non at all.
When the hose was pulled out of it's sleave it's not easy to put it back in but it doesn't matter cause once your buddy needs it, you're on your way out from that dive.
When a panicked diver came to me he didn't grab the shorter hose going to my mouth but the octopus one wich was longer (but not that long at that time) and it happened for real and not as a practice!
I guess that what you're warried about (grabing your mouthpice) is why you do it the way you do but when you dive with the same buddy who knows your configuration there's no problem and even when you dive with someone else you go over everything before the dive, including using the octopus (just as you would do with the way needed to dump the weights).
Blue Space
Contributor
Sounds like both of us are not ready for tech diving but we like the safty factor of the long hose regardless of lenght...:mean:
You know, it might be a good idea to practice your air sharing more often. If nothing else, the ease of restowing a long primary and bungeed backup encourages you to pratice often. It's even fun.
I don't see what advantages the stuffed long hose provides. Why not breathe off the long one?
There is a critical flaw in that line of reasoning. One advantage of breathing the long hose is the ease with which it can be prepared for donation, and then restowed when it is not needed. This means I can (and do) deploy the long hose second at the slightest provocation - my buddy acting strangely or slowly for whatever reason, 95% of the time it's probably nothing, but it could be symptomatic of the onset of oxygen toxicity, narcosis, hypercapnia, hypothermia, etc. Offering that reg immediately allows you to deal with such problems pre-emptively, saving precious seconds in the event that there is such a problem.
When there is not, I put the reg back in my mouth and breathe. No hose stuffing or routing issues, and the reg is immediately good to go for the next time.
-Sean
Under the assumption that that post was not a troll:
Regarding the dual bladder BC with 100 pounds of lift:
First off, 100 pounds of lift is ridiculously huge, no matter what type of diving you are doing. The lift capacity that you need is at minimum the mass of the gas that will be consumed during the dive, plus the buoyancy change of your exposure suit (if any) due to compression. If you need 100 pounds of gas, you have much larger problems than your choice of BC... My largest wing produces about 55 pounds of lift. I have used this wing on dives requiring twin 104s on the back, a 14 cu. ft. argon bottle, a slightly negative scooter and 5 AL80 stages.
The dual bladders are really unnecessary. If you are diving a drysuit, the suit provides a backup source of buoyancy. In a wetsuit, you will typically be diving aluminum tanks which become positive when empty. The logic behind using large capacity wings supposedly is to accomodate multiple stages, but stages shouldn't be steel anyway. Aluminum stages ride in a better, lower drag position, and can be jettisoned at any time without affecting the overall weighting and trim of your rig. The dual bladders (and dual hoses) also introduce a hose routing problem, and well as adding failure points and unnecessary complexity for a purpose of questionable value.
As someone else mentioned, these wings are so large as to require retainer cords to keep the package neatly bundled. In a typical (non restrained) wing, the wing floats up against the tank(s), resulting in a low profile package which places the buoyancy cells above and to the side of the diver, acting to keep the diver horizontal in the position of maximum function. Any action on the diver's part to change attitude results in a differential distribution of gas within the wing, which will remain stable until altered. The restrained wing keeps the gas cell close to the diver's center of mass, making it easier to roll out of position, and more difficult to maintain a desired attitude once established.
The retainer cords also act to create a constant positive pressure within the bladder, which makes dumping gas more rapid, and puts you at risk of inadvertently dumping all the gas in your wing should you puncture or tear it by accident. A standard wing will in most cases still hold gas when punctured, whereas a complete dumping can be extremely dangerous in an emergency. The redundant bladders are an obvious attempt to correct a self-imposed problem.
Another problem with these wings is that, due to the positive pressure created by the retainers, an artificial and unnecessary lung loading is presented when attempting to orally inflate. If you consider the scenarios which would require you to attempt this, it makes sense not to increase the potential complications to your physiological processes.
Finally, the folds in the bladder and cords crossing the retained wing present a snag hazard to objects which might otherwise brush against a wing without these features without incident.
There are a few things off the top of my head, with respect to a single item on your list. I'd write more, but my fingers are getting tired of typing.
Cheers.
-Sean
The 7ft hose is ackward at first, but after diving it you'll figure all this out. Here some tips:
1. Put a clip on it and clip it off when no in use or changing rigs.
The clip should be tied off with 3 wraps on cave line up on the hose, not the metal connections. You should be able to put the reg in your mouth while its still clipped off. Zip ties will slid up and down the hose, cave line will stick without damange.
2. Forget about break away O-rings. Just use cave line
3. Stuff the hose through the handle on the 27lb Halcyon wing when not diving.
Clip the reg off, grab the loop in the hose and run in through the handle and lay the hose down behind the wing. ** Make sure the loop does not get wrapped around the pressure guage. ** Slide in the back plate, put on the waist and crotch strap, and then you can unclip the long hose, pull it all the way out and secure it properly.
Hope that helps!
1. Put a clip on it and clip it off when no in use or changing rigs.
The clip should be tied off with 3 wraps on cave line up on the hose, not the metal connections. You should be able to put the reg in your mouth while its still clipped off. Zip ties will slid up and down the hose, cave line will stick without damange.
2. Forget about break away O-rings. Just use cave line
3. Stuff the hose through the handle on the 27lb Halcyon wing when not diving.
Clip the reg off, grab the loop in the hose and run in through the handle and lay the hose down behind the wing. ** Make sure the loop does not get wrapped around the pressure guage. ** Slide in the back plate, put on the waist and crotch strap, and then you can unclip the long hose, pull it all the way out and secure it properly.
Hope that helps!
Similar threads
